Who Can The Packers Afford In Free Agency?

Overthecap has updated its records to reflect the increased salaries earned by Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams, both of whom qualified under the Proven Performance Enhancer, and also for Aaron Rodgers' escalator clauses, OTC estimates that the Packers have $23.7 million in cap space for 2020 under the rule of 51, assuming a $200 million salary cap limit. 

Jones and Williams each played enough snaps in their first three seasons to reach the threshold for the PPE increase, a net of roughly $2.8 million.  Rodgers earned increases in his salary of $100K, another $120K, and another $130K, and another $100K for playing 72.5% of possible snaps, the team reaching the divisional playoff game, reaching the conference championship, and for being in the top three in interception percentage.  That translated into a $450,000 increase in Rodgers' base salary for 2020.

The Packers with the signing of players to futures contracts now have more than 51 players under contract.  Signing their ten draft picks might cost about $7.4 million but the net under the rule of 51 should be about $2.8 million.  That reduces available cap space to $20.9 million under the rule of 51.

That is not what the Packers can spend.  The rule of 51 does end when final cutdowns are made and the salaries of the 52nd and 53rd player count (probably $510,000 times 2).  Each practice squad player earns a minimum of $8,400 per week.  The minimum for 10 players over 17 weeks is $1.43 million.  Combined that further reduces available cap space by $2.45 million eventually, leaving a net of $18.45 million.

Sadly, the Packers also need to leave room for misfortune.  Last year, being unable to cut Spriggs, Curtis Bolton, and Malcom Johnson due to injury cut into cap space by $1.45 million, and Equanimeous St. Brown added another $452,000, while Greg Roberts (PUP all season) reduced cap space by yet another $456,000 for a total of $2.36 million.  That was considerably worse than the average year, but the team must have sufficient cap space to meet such eventualities. 

Note that I did not include Lane Taylor since his transer to IR meant he did not earn his $31,250 per game active bonus, which just covered the cost of replacing him with a player earning the minimum salary. I might have included Sternberger's ten game stint on IR: he does not have a game active bonus to help defray the cost of his absence.  He did have a split contract, meaning his compensation was reduced while he was on IR.  In general, players who do not have game active bonuses (particularly players who were not expected to make the 53-man roster) are just dead losses on the salary cap.

Finally, the Packers usually like to roll over money into the next season's cap space.  However, since the CBA is coming to an end, there is no guarantee that rollovers will be allowed.  When the CBA ended in 2010, the new agreement did not allow teams to carry over cap space into the years covered by the new CBA; instead there was an uncapped year.

That brings up some important issues.  There are teams with massive amounts of cap space that do not know for sure whether they will be allowed to roll it over into the 2021 season.  I would not want to be the General Manager who left his team with $40 million in cap space only to find out that it cannot be rolled over into 2021, and thus it has simply vanished.  Teams have better knowledge about the negotiations with the union and how big an issue this might be than outsiders, but I suspect that teams will spend like there is no tommorow. 

Finally, teams have to spend a certain percentage of the cap over a four year period but they also have to spend a certain percentage in cash.  The following teams have to spend cash: the Colts ($43 million under the cash threshold with $87M in cap space), the Cowboys ($45M and $77M in space - likely to be used on Prescott and Cooper), the Ravens ($47M but just $26M in space), the Chargers ($48M and $48M) and the Bills ($53M and $80M in space).  These numbers are per a nice acticle by Jason Fitzgerald at overthecap.  You can read that article by clicking here.

Teams can spend the cap and cash in various ways.  They can buy back future money and put the cap hit into the 2020 year.  They can push their cash spending with signing bonus.  Still, I suspect that there will be more inflation in free agent contracts than normal.

Bottom Line:  The Packers should probably allow for $5 million in space for misfortune and churn during the season which when removed from the $18.45 million net above leaves about $13.85M to spend.  It is widely assumed that the Packers will release Jimmy Graham and Lane Taylor to pick up $12.21 million in cap space.  The only other potential cap casualties with significant cap implications involve Adams, Bakhtiari, Clark and Linsley. The first three names are all safe.  I believe Linsley is also safe, but his release would results in cap savings of $8.5 million.  

It seems self-evident to me that releasing Linsley just opens up another hole in the roster.  He has played well enough to be retained.  Linsley is in a contract year.  Clark almost certainly is going to be extended if they can agree on a contract.  Clark's cap number is $7.69 million, all cash.  The Packers could extend him without increasing his cap number, though I had been thinking it would increase by a few million.  Bakhtiari has a $14.7 million cap number for 2020 and becomes a UFA in 2021.  The Packers could extend him and even generate several million in cap space.  Bakhtiari will probably eclipse the pay of the highest paid tackle, Lane Johnson, who makes $18 million AAV.  No one knows whether the Packers will be able to franchise tag Bakhtiari and/or Clark after the 2020 season since the CBA ends and there might be no franchise tag, or it might work differently.

I would estimate that the Packers can prudently spend $26.06 million on their own free agents and any outside free agents.


Packer Free Agents:

Player

OTC

Comment

2020 cap #

Bulaga 8.9M Sportrac value 10.1M AAV.  Age 30. PFF grade 77.9 8.0M
Tramon 7.4M None.  Age 36.  75.1 PFF grade. Would accept one year deal. 6.5M
Crosby 2.9M None. Career year at age 35.  Packers re-sign at $5M AAV, play it safe. 3.5M
Martinez 8.9M Sportrac value: 16.3M AAV.  Age 26.  I don't believe $16.3M.  Perhaps 11.5M AAV 7.0M
Lewis 3.7M None.  Age 35.  70.5 PFF grade. 2.5M
Fackrell 2.2M None. Age 28.  62.4 PFF grade.  442 snaps, 10 QB hits, 2 TFL, 23 tackles 1.5M^
Ervin 1.0M None, Age 26 59.8 PFF grade, but doesn't include PRs and KRs. 1.0M
Veldheer 1.6M None. Age 32 69.5 PFF grade in just 35 snaps.  One year deal? 3.5M^
Redmond 1.7M None. Age 26 56.1 PFF grade.  Better playing deep - his grade hurt playing closer to LOS 1.1M
Campbell 1.5M None. Age 27 60.5 PFF grade.  Greene looked better.  OTC includes ST abililty 1.1M
Allison 2.5M None. Age 26 54.1 PFF grade. 34 recs/284 yds (8.4 ave). 6 fumbles in 90 career touches! 2.0M
Goodson 1.7M None. Age 26, 60.9 PFF grade  37 tackles, 0 QB hits, 0 TFL, 0 pressures, just 2 missed tackles 1.5M
Misc N-A Spriggs, Grant, min at best.  Malcom Johnson no RFA tender N-A
Misc N-A ERFAs Sullivan, Lazard, Lancaster, Kumerow, Tonyan and perhaps Leglue.  0.5M

Bulaga is a question, but I would re-sign him for 3yrs/$31.5 million and use a first year cap number of $8M down to try to get an easy out after 2 years and some kind of out after one year.  Conklin is very similar in PFF grade but Sportrac estimates Conklin's market value at $15M AAV since he is only 26 years old.  There are some ancient tackles available like Whitworth and Jason Peters, Constanzo (who said if he doesn't retire he would only re-sign with the Colts), who all have better PFF grades than Bulaga, and 34 year old Demar Dotson (PFF grade 71). All of them probably cost as much or more than Bulaga.  There are a lot of tackles but if they are younger will cost almost as much, maybe more, than Bulaga and all represent significant downgrades from Bulaga.

I watched four condensed games with Turner playing right tackle for Denver.  He is a big downgrade as a tackle.  Some folks want to cut Linsley and insert Lucas Patrick at OC or move Jenkins to center and insert Patrick (to gain $8.5 million in cap space) or insert Lane Taylor at left guard (which saves $8.5M - $4.21M = about $4.3 million).  All of these machinations harm the quality of the offensive line, and I do not want to mess with Jenkins' development at guard.  The Packers would almost have to re-sign Bulaga as well. 

The options appear to be re-signing Bulaga or using a first or (gulp) a second round draft pick on a tackle.  I often see four (once just three, several times five) tackles mocked to go in the first round.  The combine likely will change things.  At present, I am not sure I would want to rely on Mekhi Becton, Prince Tega Wonogho or someone like them starting day one at right tackle.  .

Tramon Williams:  Tramon had a very nice year.  The Packers have Alexander, King (contract year) and Sullivan returning.  Sullivan might be able to soak up Tramon's 722 snaps and his own 356 snaps should the Packers let Williams walk.  That would leave them pretty thin in the event of injury or just for the rotation.  Josh Jackson played 103 uninspiring snaps and Hollman played just four.  I do like Hollman, and Ento as well.  Letting Tramon Williams walk is a bit of a gamble.  There are a lot of free agent cornerbacks.  Sportrac listed both Trae Waynes' and MacKensie Alexander's values at $8.4 million AAV, for example.  Waynes' had a pretty decent 65.7 PFF grade and was listed by PFF as the 45 most alluring free agent, with Alexander coming in 65th.  There are lots of other cornerbacks (18 on PFF's list): I mentioned those two because Sportrac assigned market values to them.

The Packers could re-sign Williams, sign a different free agent cornerback, or elect to stand pat with their current group, perhaps drafting one at some point.

 Martinez:  I cannot wrap my mind around Sportrac's $16.3 million AAV valuation, but then I was shocked when Kwon Alexander got $13.5 million last year.  As a fan, I have no idea how Summers looks in practice.  Goodson's PFF grade somehow is about the same as Martinez'.  Burks barely played, and badly when he did (45 PFF grade).  There are free agents available.  Corey Littleton is probably a $15 million plus AAV player even though OTC valued him at $8.4 million.  Bobby Wagner signed just last year for $18 million AAV (really closer to $16 million looking at the structure), and Littleton arguably had a better year.  Littleton's first year cap number probably would be in the $10 million range.  You can read our own Maggie Loney's article that looks at Littleton here 

Joe Schobert is another possibility.  He has an excellent coverage grade but a run defense in the low fifties, and an overall PFF grade of 59.1, which is not dissimilar to Martinez' grade.  Schobert had 127 tackles to Blake's 155, but added 4 INTs and two forced fumbles.  Pro Football Focus listed Schobert as the 41st best free agent, and Littleton as the 16th best.  Schobert has historically graded in the fifties against the run.  He probably costs $13 to $15M and would have a first-year cap hit of about $8.5 million.

Other possibilities I see include Kwiatkoski, Travathan, Patrick Onwuasor, and Elandon Roberts.  I did take note when one reader opined that Martinez was better than Kwiatkoski, who has a 72.6 PFF grade.  OTC valued Kwiatkoski at $5.3 million, though it looks like OTC takes playing time into consideration, and thus probably downgraded him for playing 47% of possible snaps. Onwuasor had a dreadful 2019 (OTC value of $1 million and a 49.2 PFF grade), but he has had good years in the past.  Travathan will be 32 years old and started just 9 games before being hurt. Elandon Roberts was mentioned by profootballrumors as a darkhorse free agent.  He got a 61.9 PFF grade and a $1.46 million valuation by OTC while playing just 20% of possible snaps.

Miscellaneous: It seems likely that the Packers will re-sign Crosby ($3.5M), Lewis or someone like him ($2.5M), and all of their ERFAs (adds up to just an extra $500,000 under the rule of 51) at a first-year cap cost of $6.5 million.  Many people think Fackrell will command a decent contract, something far more than the $3 million AAV I envision for him: if so I would let him walk.  That would leave at most $19.5 million to deal with Bulaga ($8M?), and the inside linebacker, defensive line, tight end, cornerback and wide receiver positions.  They could sign at least one and in a pinch two fairly big-name free agents or one expensive player and a couple of mid-tier free agents.

What will General Manager Gutekunst do?  What would you do?  

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19 points

Comments (87)

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PeteK's picture

February 01, 2020 at 12:31 pm

Excellent job clarifying the cap capabilities of the upcoming season! Packers are a SB contending team and need veterans at key positions. My first choice is Hooper at TE because he is the young veteran blocker, chain mover and red zone weapon that we desperately need. Resign Bulaga( Veldeer as backup/ins) and Martinez at about 8 mill caps for each because I don't trust rookies at RT and ILB signal caller. Since we have a stud in Clark on the DL, a good DL can be drafted. A quicker and coverage type of ILB can also be found in the draft.

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Lare's picture

February 01, 2020 at 01:00 pm

If I'm not mistaken, both Bulaga and Tauscher before him both started at RT as rookies.

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PeteK's picture

February 01, 2020 at 03:50 pm

Yes, SB with Bulaga as a rookie. Tauscher 7th rounder! Ok , we can go with a rookie at RT. Littleton can be signed with money saved.

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Guam's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:25 pm

If you don't resign Bulaga, you'd better resign Veldheer as plan B if your rookie draftee OT doesn't work out.

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dobber's picture

February 02, 2020 at 11:09 am

Agreed. There has been many an NFL team whose season has been hampered by a rookie who wasn't ready to play.

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Leatherhead's picture

February 02, 2020 at 05:44 pm

I think that resigning an older tackle with an injury history to start for the next couple of years while simultaneously throwing away a younger, experienced starter who costs far less does not improve our line. At best it makes it older than last year.

If the Packers stand pat, we have 8 pretty good guys on the active roster: Bakhtiari, Jenkins, Linsley, Turner, Taylor, Light, Madison, Patrick. Not a single rookie, everybody will have an offseason, age shouldn’t be an issue. The question is whether we have a RT in the bunch. If not, then I agree with TGR that we’ll need one early in the draft.

I don’t think we should blow a bunch of holes in the line by releasing Taylor or Linsley. Injuries occur and protecting our QB and making holes for the backs are going to be our most critical objectives on offense and these guys are experienced and capable vets. We are trying to win NOW with Rodgers and that means the fewer developing youngsters we have, the better. Lane Taylor will be a better player this season than some Day 3 rookie.

Any FA money we spend on offense should be directed at a veteran TE who can get his man blocked and catch a couple of short passes each game to go along with Tonyan and Sternberger.

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Leatherhead's picture

February 02, 2020 at 07:13 pm

Not quite, Pete.

First, there’s no guarantee we could sign Littleton, or Schobert, or any of the mentioned ILBs. Other teams will be bidding for them, too. We could come out of this with holes at RT and ILB where we’d need starters.

I think it makes more sense to keep the 25 year old leader of the defense who never misses games than it does to keep a 30 year old OT with an injury history, so on that point we certainly agree. I think we should sign Martinez and a veteran TE in free agency and take an OT in the top 100 picks.

That still leaves us with two premium picks. DL and ILB could help us defend a little better.

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Madfan's picture

February 01, 2020 at 12:33 pm

Very interesting analysis. Thank you!

In terms of where can the Packers make the greatest difference for the money expended, I'd have to say ILBer. I'm not sure there is a draftee who can step in a play right away that would be available with the 30th pick. You cannot count on Murray or Queen being available or ready to play in their first year. Kwiakowski at $5.3 million could be adequate based on watching him play against GB.

I would draft to replace LInsley in 2021. There must be a J. C. Tretter-like player to select in the 3rd or 4th round.

I'd put the bulk of the money into contracts for Bulaga and Clark. Crosby would be a lower priority in my mind. T. Williams is too hard to judge right now without knowing the condition of his legs.

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packerbackerjim's picture

February 01, 2020 at 01:37 pm

If Jerry Gray can coach up Josh Jackson, the cap situation benefits. As a result, extensions may take place later in the process.

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Thegravedigger's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:01 pm

I would imagine if kwiatkowski is only 5 mil, the bears would resign him n let travathan walk but im not sure what there cap looks like.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:43 pm

OTC shows just $4.9M, but they have a bunch of cap casualty prospects. Leonard Floyd ($13.22M cap savings with no dead), Prince Amukamara ($9M), Kyle Long ($8.1M), Cordorelle Patterson ($5.2M), and Taylor Gabriel ($4.5M). Floyd and Amukamara are reasonably good but Floyd isn't worth $13M. Long is always injured (250 snaps in 2019 with 511 snaps being his highest total in the last 4 seasons). Patterson and Long probably should be gone, and they should renegotiate Floyd.

Their UFAs are Kwiatkoski, Trevathan, Clinton-Dix, Aaron Lynch, and Chase Daniel. RFA Roy Robertson-Harris probably gets a $3M tender. I wonder if they take a peek at one of the likely to be discarded QBs like Mariotta, etc.

CHI probably has to let a couple of players walk. No first-round pick, but two 2nds and some day three picks.

Note that OTC valued Kwiatkoski at $5.2M, but lots of players listed should command more money than OTC's valuation. Sometimes 50% to 100% more. But yes, I'd expect Kwiatkoski to be less than Martinez. I'd try to keep Kwiatkoski and Lynch and let the rest go if I were the Bears.

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HankScorpio's picture

February 02, 2020 at 09:35 am

I think Long announced his retirement.

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Houndog's picture

February 01, 2020 at 12:49 pm

Would letting Mark Murphy go free up any cap space? :)

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Slim11's picture

February 01, 2020 at 12:56 pm

Very informative!

I read this after looking at several mock drafts. The conventional wisdom there is for the Packers to draft a WR, then a TE. What does this have to do with free agent signings?

I wouldn't mind letting Martinez walk if Gutekunst is looking to draft an ILB in the first round. Queen from LSU sticks in my mind and a couple of the mock drafts have him slipping to the second round. He won't last until the #62 selection.

PeteK said"...I don't trust rookies at RT..."

Bulaga started at RT as a rookie after Mark Tauscher went down with an injury. That worked out well. If Martinez leaves Green Bay, then I see Gutekunst re-signing Bulaga. I like the idea of re-signing Veldeer.

Signing Kenny Clark is critical.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 01, 2020 at 01:13 pm

Bulaga was taken 23rd and was the fourth offensive tackle selected. He started 12 games, beginning in week five, and played in all 16.

So, yes, 2010 compares pretty well to the way the draft looks now. At #30, GB would be selecting the 4th OT, maybe the 5th. I would be gulping if GB waited until pick 62, though there does seem to be some depth going by some of the big boards. So, I concede that point. Just worried that our run game and pass protection would suffer. Bulaga was pretty good right away.

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fordguy's picture

February 01, 2020 at 01:36 pm

Any rumors on what veldheer plans to do next year as regarding whether he wants to start or is OK with playing backup? He would be a good mentor and backup if they decide to go the draft option at RT.

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:18 pm

I would favor using #30 on an OT @ that spot. There are good WRs in the second round or He can move UP the board to get his guy. Some of Bulaga's money goes to a Free agent DE/DT, maybe a slot CB.

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marpag1's picture

February 03, 2020 at 08:16 am

I agree with your assessment that the draft is very WR heavy, but I don't think that means it's wise to take the OT first. It MIGHT work out that way, but in the end I think it still comes down to value for that place in the draft. If a glut of excellent WRs pushes a top 10 type guy down to #30, then you take him, even if there are solid WRs but few tackles left when you pick again. I know some people will argue against my view, and that's OK.

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wildbill's picture

February 01, 2020 at 02:14 pm

Excellent article! Thanks so much. I think Crosby and Bulaga are the top two priorities. Signing Veldheer would be great as insurance but he played well and may command more and want to start somewhere. Plenty of mock drafts have us picking WRs with our first two picks, I pray this doesn’t happen. I see wr as a big need but DL just as much of a need. That being said the off season will always go different than I expect, which is part of the fun.

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TXcheese34's picture

February 01, 2020 at 02:31 pm

Bulaga obviously is the big ?
Feels like the TJ Lang situation where we
want him back but the market price
is too much for the player to ignore

Crosby is a must keep - have you seen
the dumpster fire kicker situations across
the league?

Blake is gone we need to upgrade there
regardless of price. He doesn’t make
impact plays. I’d go cheaper FAcoption
like kwiatowski then absolutely have
to draft one early - Murray? Queen?
Baun? Troy Dye?

Tramon I’d bring back on a one year vet
min deal but corner is a sneaky need
in my opinion. Could see us adding one
3/4th round.

I think we’re good at tight end with Jace/Tonyan
and bring back Big Dog for one more

WR - try for Robby Andersen and draft one high
Jefferson? Reagor? Or second round Mims?
Pittman? KJ hill? Lotta options

Gutes knows what he’s doing trust the process

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:24 pm

Pretty sound reasoning. I would get two WRs from this draft, plug-and-play.in lieu of offering a deal to Anderson.
A lot of Playmakers in this draft. Tramon looked aggressive this year. I would bring him back even if he plays the dime.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 01, 2020 at 02:58 pm

There really aren't that many permutations. Remember that FA happens before the Packers find out which players are available to draft, but at least the combine is done prior to the legal tampering period.

Most of these first-year cap hits are 60% of my estimated AAV for that player (and I've been off on those over the years plenty of times). Bulaga is at 80%, so I suppose one could assign a 2020 cap number of $5M or $6M. When TT signed Peppers, he used a $3.5M first-year cap number for a contract with an $8.67M AAV. That's just 40% of AAV.

Anyway, GB could sign Bulaga and Littleton, but then, other than one very minor FA they would be done.

There are a ton of free agent DL. Most strike me at DTs - I would love a DE instead, one who is stout against the run and has some pass rush, but they are few and expensive. The list includes Wolfe, Suh, Ansah, McCoy, Leonard Williams ($8.2 AAV per sportrac, 70.2 PFF), Armstead, Ngakoue ($17.2M AAV sportrac, 72 PFF), Chris Jones, Ronald Blair (PFF 77.5 he missed time and is listed at 270 lbs), and Chris Jones (a lot of $$).

There are a lot of DTs as well. Shelby Harris ($11.7M AAV sportrac), Michael Pierce ($4.7M AAV - so cap hit in 2020 of perhaps $3M - seems low to me but the Ravens are low on cap space), Jernigan, A'Shawn Robinson (56 PFF grade), DJ Reader (32nd on the PFF top 100, $11.9 AAV sportrac), Javon Hargrave (83 PFF, 33rd o top 100, $14.7 AAV sportrac), Jarran Reed (just okay, 60 PFF), Mike Daniels, Brockers, Dareus, Billings and more.

The draft is strong in WR and OTs. Love it if Murray dropped to 30, but he is just one prospect. Perhaps buy an ILB and a DL, even a cheaper run stuffer.

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Guam's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:21 pm

Your usual stellar job with the financials TGR. Thank you.

Given Pettine's stated preference for stopping the pass first and his penchant for playing a nickel defense with R. Greene or I. Campbell as a hybrid safety/ILB, the Packers generally only play with one true ILB on the field (Martinez this past season). I would seem that we need a run stuffer in that ILB position, not a coverage guy.

Given that both Littleton and Schobert have much better coverage grades than run stuffing grades, is there a mismatch between the available FA ILBs and the Packer needs? Maybe neither is what we need at ILB.

It seems as though there is good value with veteran FA DL's and we might be able to pick up two with our cap space. A solidified defensive line would go a long way to fixing our leaky run defense and may be a better answer than a very expensive FA coverage ILB.

Given that Martinez is not coming back, I am sure Gute has a plan. Would love to know what it is!

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jeremyjjbrown's picture

February 02, 2020 at 03:55 pm

I like the idea of Pierce. I wouldn't want to spend a lot on a FA lineman given Pettine would rather not have a 3rd DL on the field.

Who knows maybe M Adams lives in the weight room this summer and gets strong enough to look good in the regular season too. He has to know this his last shot if he doesn't.

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Guam's picture

February 02, 2020 at 04:17 pm

Supposedly M. Adams lived in the weight room last offseason and had "the best offseason of any Packer" according to team sources and look where that got him. I think M. Adams is done and the Packers would be much better off investing in a FA DL (and yes, Pierce would be a good addition).

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 02, 2020 at 08:39 pm

One can look at it both ways. Pettine wants to defend the pass first, so a coverage ILB makes some sense. To compensate for the ILB's deficiencies as a run defender, find another DL who is really good against the run. Pettine is only going to play two DL, so Clark and Pierce would improve the run defense.

Littleton was considerably better than Martinez against the run. Schobert was noticeably better than Martinez against the run. Both are massively better against the pass. I am tired of passes over the middle.

Not saying that you're wrong. If Martinez, Littleton, Schobert and Kwiatkowski all are not what GB is looking for, then I hope that Ty Summers is somebody they like, or an ILB prospect is on the board for them in the top 125 picks or so.

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Guam's picture

February 03, 2020 at 08:18 am

I haven't watched Littleton play (ever) and the last time I watched Schobert play he had a Wisconsin jersey on so I have no idea how well either defends the run. I had questions about them because according to PFF they seem to be better pass defenders than run defenders and our need seems to be more about stopping the run. If they are significantly better run defenders than Martinez, then I would be happy to have them in a Packer uniform.

I still believe that no matter who we have at ILB, we need to upgrade our DL. The best run stopping ILB is a guy the DL keeps clean from interior OL and we did a very poor job of keeping Martinez clean. I suspect either Littleton or Schobert will also struggle in run defense unless we do a better job of keeping offensive linemen off them.

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Leatherhead's picture

February 03, 2020 at 02:27 pm

Tired of passes over the middle? Martinez gave up 61 completions in 16 games....less than 4 completions per game for about 35 yards.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 01, 2020 at 03:16 pm

As a note, I agree with Ken Ingalls of Packer Cap, who indicates that Ibraheim Campbell's contract tolled because he was on the PUP for 6 games in the last year of his contract. Despite being active for 7 games, per Article 20, he was still on the PUP as of game 6, his contract tolled. He is not a UFA. His minimum is $820K and he eligible for a qualified contract with a cap number of $660,000.

I thought Campbell would be better than Greene. It doesn't look like he was, but he was in the same ballpark and is okay. Cheap depth.

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flackcatcher's picture

February 02, 2020 at 07:16 pm

Great work TGR. Campbell's knee injury was far worst than reported. That he was able to play this year was surprising. With another off season of rehab his knee should be stronger than when he injured it. While Greene came back on the roster, I suspect he is in the same position as Campbell was a few months ago. We'll know more at the OTA and training camp. (That is if the players don't go on strike, or the owners don't lock them out. Whatever comes first....)

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Lphill's picture

February 01, 2020 at 03:23 pm

What about if Graham is released ? How much cap space would be added? Does anyone else think that Tony Morrison and Breshard Breland would have helped the defense against the run? I do

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dobber's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:44 pm

"Does anyone else think that Tony Morrison and Breshard Breland would have helped the defense against the run?"

I don't think so. I hear she really let herself go after The Bluest Eye and Beloved became best-sellers.

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PeteK's picture

February 02, 2020 at 10:02 am

Hahahaha , one of her characters probably would of done a better job stopping the run against Niners.

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flackcatcher's picture

February 02, 2020 at 07:18 pm

COOKIE!!!!

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:49 pm

Sadly, I ditched Graham right away - assumed he was a goner. He has $8M in cap savings, but that's part of the $19.5M available to spend. Ditched Lane Taylor as well.

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mamasboy's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:02 pm

I'm pretty sure I heard cutting Graham would save about 8 million or a little more next year. We should have between 45 and 50 million in cap space.But we have to sign Clark, and maybe Williams and Bulaga too. They might have enough to bring in one pricey free agent after that. I'd really like to see former Badger Joe Schobert, in a packers uniform.

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Lare's picture

February 01, 2020 at 03:58 pm

If the Packers cut Graham, Tayler & Linsley it appears the Packers could gain about $21 million against of salary cap this offseason leaving them with around $50 million in salary cap space. If I'm not mistaken Bakhtiari, Linsley, Jenkins and Bulaga were all rookie starters which leads to me to believe that the Packers could utilize Patrick, Veldheer and/or drafted rookies on the OL and save a lot of of salary cap space. That would allow them to sign a free agent ILB, WR and DL and still have enough leftover to re-sign Clark, Crosby and some other mid level FA's.

IMO, the Packers should have the financial freedom to improve the roster depending on if Gutekunst is willing to make some hard decisions. If he decides to keep some of their overpriced veterans then there won't be enough money left to do much in free agency.

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dobber's picture

February 01, 2020 at 06:37 pm

Just not a huge fan of blowing extra holes in the OL that they'll have to spend their generated cap room to fix. Ask Rick Spielman how that works.

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Leatherhead's picture

February 02, 2020 at 09:40 am

I’m with Dobber when it comes to blowing holes in the roster.

TGR, this was a very good job of laying it out.

I’m not going to offer suggestions other than I think we should run more and throw less and that our off season personnel moves should reflect that.

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PeteK's picture

February 02, 2020 at 10:08 am

A good TE and blocking fullback would achieve that.

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marpag1's picture

February 03, 2020 at 08:02 am

I don't know about throw less, and I don't think we really should throw more, but I definitely think we need to throw BETTER. And that will almost certainly NOT happen unless we can get Davante a competent #2. We need a decent WR sooooooooo bad.......

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stockholder's picture

February 02, 2020 at 10:33 am

How did Taylor work out? (vs. Wilkins) Any agent could make a point to re-sign their client. Even Graham. Gute may decide that Graham needs to come back. Just like Lewis. The point is are they used up? Whats left in the tank? Over paid? CAP. We got better by adding FAs.!!!! But we also let Daniels go with No answer. We also let CM3 go instead of putting him in the middle. The problem was and is, "No answer". If Gute releases people just to fit the cap. There will be holes. Every team has a weak spot. I've seen the top 100 FA Boards, and it's easy to see where some players rate. Judge Bulaga on that board!!! Just because they get resigned, doesn't mean you have fixed the hole.

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dobber's picture

February 02, 2020 at 11:12 am

Seriously. Taylor is no loss to cut. They've already extended Patrick as his replacement. Please--trade Taylor for a bag of kicking tees so you get something in return for him. But cutting a backup G isn't blowing a hole in your OL.

Cutting Linsley to get his cap relief--even though he's playing at a level that is in line with his pay-- seems counterproductive unless you have an obvious upgrade on the roster. I'm not convinced Patrick is an upgrade, and even though I thought Jenkins was drafted as the heir-apparent at C, putting Patrick in at G seems to be a downgrade to me. They can cut Linsley pretty much any time and realize his cap savings since he has no roster bonuses or salary guarantees for 2020. My point is that, If you're going to cut him, make sure your line is set, first. Don't pitch him and then hope. That's a recipe for disaster.

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fordguy's picture

February 01, 2020 at 06:22 pm

Do you realize that Veldheer is 33 years old and came out of retirement to play with the Packers? He might come back as a backup, but who knows if he's even going to play again.

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dobber's picture

February 02, 2020 at 10:57 am

...and has an extended history of injury, himself. As a backup, much less of a risk. But the reason he retired in the first place--at least the reason he stated publicly--is that he was just too beat up.

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mrtundra's picture

February 03, 2020 at 10:05 am

Is Veldheer coming back? He was "retired" before the Packers got him. Will he want to play another season or will he hang it up?

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Pack1956's picture

February 01, 2020 at 04:20 pm

Excellent article, within fiscal reasoning we should absolutely resign Crosby, as proof all you need as a reminder is “no senor”
Jace hopefully develops as go to tight end
GoPackGo

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ShooterMcGee's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:17 pm

The 5 free agents to resign are Crosby, Lewis, Veldheer, Williams, and Ervin. Allow Bulaga, Martinez, Fackrell, and the rest to test free agency. These players cost too much for their expected value to the team. Veldheer can replace Bulaga, Gary replaces Fackrell, and a free agent such as Kwiatowski or Schobert can replace Martinez. The draft is loaded at WR which will fill our needs at that position. We also can draft and develop at OT, ILB, RB, DL, and TE with out 10 draft picks. It would not surprise me if we took QB Eason with our 1st round pick.

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stockholder's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:37 pm

We Know we have to have Clark. Then Clean House. Trade Linsley.!! Why wait. This draft has Centers. And No to Bulaga and Martinez. Draft Wrs in Rd 1 and 2 and be done with it. Get the best first!

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stockholder's picture

February 01, 2020 at 08:46 pm

Cory Littleton pay him !5 mil. We must have him. Sign Veldheer before Bulaga. We must have a OT, and draft the future here. Next Two DLs. Jarron Reed works. Also Billings. 15 mil between them. Now draft Offense. I love Higgins. So a #30 and a 5th rd. Gets him . Next Reagor Wr is my pick. Getting Reagor cost #60 and a cond. second rd next year. He did have a poor QB. Still his deep jumps drop him. With the 3rd pick Shane Lemieux G With the 4th Mc Farland RB/ With the 6ths Coughin. Edge replaces Fackrell. Blankinship K. Thomas Wr Jon Ronyan Ot. Pettine will switch his defense to that of KCs after the Super-bowl.

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ShooterMcGee's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:41 pm

Just did a Packers draft on Fanspeak that may fill many of our needs-
1- Adams OT
2- Eason QB
3- Aiyuk WR
4- Queen ILB
5- Blacklock DL
6- Benjamin RB
6- Akeem Davis Gaithers ILB
7- Duguara TE
7- Thomas WR
7- Frantz OT

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stockholder's picture

February 01, 2020 at 06:06 pm

Adams had a bad back. - People we can get any FA OT with 10 mil. Much younger and just as good.

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HankScorpio's picture

February 03, 2020 at 07:15 am

That draft class would be fantastic. Draft season is just heating up but the board used to produce that result seems very suspect to me. Nobody really knows what the actual value on players will be. So anything is possible.

Based on what I seeing as a more general consensus, if Adams and Queen were to become Packers, the rounds would be flipped. Blacklock is a day 2 guy. Benjamin and Davis Gaithers are late day 2, early day 3 guys.

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HankScorpio's picture

February 05, 2020 at 07:09 am

An even more ridiculous draft board is Deep Fried Draft. If you want serious draft analysis, stay away. If you want to a good laugh, try it. I used trading down to add extra picks. And "reached" a whole bunch.

Here is the result. It's a hoot. I ended up with 3 guys that may not make it to 30....after trading down a few times with #30

49. Henry Ruggs
62. Patrick Queen
94. Laviska Shenault
98. Lucas Niang
102. Leki Fotu
123. Prince Teno Wanagho (I assume they meant Auburn OT whose name is similar)
132. Ashtyn Davis
133. Cesar Ruiz
137. Thaddeaus Moss
175. Darrynton Evans
192. Darnay Holmes
209. Alton Robinson
224. Quartney Davis
242. Francis Bernard

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4zone's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:44 pm

The numbers are a bit confusing but a well documented article.

I am thinking Martinez holds GB in very high regard and very well might take a lesser contract to stay. Not a guarantee but possible. I might re-sign him for that, Crosby for sure, and Bulaga if his numbers don't get stupid.

Then we could add some second shelf FAs at DL and ILB in like Schobert.

I like 3 guys in the draft but we probably will have to trade up in Rd 3 to get the third. Reagor WR, Trautman TE and Jordyn Brook ILB. Getting all three may not be possible if Trautman does to the combine what he did tot the Sr. Bowl.

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MarkinMadison's picture

February 01, 2020 at 05:54 pm

Five problems with Linsley. 1) He's coming up on 30 so the Packers probably won't resign him next year. 2) His replacement was drafted last year, his name is Jenkins, and he was thought of by many as the best pure Center in the draft last year. 3) His cap number. 4) There were some bobbled exchanges with the QB this year, and I'm just stunned by that given how long these guys have been together. 5) His shotgun snap has always been less than stellar in my view - it is a big reason MM deployed the pistol so often instead of the shotgun formation. I respect TGR's desire to avoid a lot of change on the line, but I think it hits this year or next year, so let's just have done with it. Use the savings to Bulaga's long-term replacement and trust that you have or can develop a competent LG. If stockholder is right and you can get something in trade for Linsley that is a bonus.

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stockholder's picture

February 01, 2020 at 06:10 pm

I know he had time off with a back problem.

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Timeout's picture

February 01, 2020 at 08:51 pm

Or they could give Lucas Patrick the position and leave Jenkins right where he is. Patrick filled in for Linsley and did a decent job IMO. They just signed him to a contract extension so maybe that's the way they are headed.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 02, 2020 at 12:20 am

I agree with all five things you listed. Linsley is widely regarded as an above average OC. His PFF grade is 69.5. His $8.5M pay ranks 15th highest. His compensation is fair. Now, the issue is whether Linsley's compensation is worth it to GB (is there a replacement) or if his cap savings could be put to a higher use.

Lucas Patrick confuses me. I thought he played largely pretty well in week 5 against Dallas (54 snaps). So he has some decent play on tape. He was set to be an RFA (Tender for rt. of refusal is $2.14M and the 2nd round tender is $3.28M). I expected him to sign for somewhere in between those two numbers. On December 28, he signs for $1.487M, and worse, for two years at that number. On December 29 (week 17 vs. Detroit), he relieves Linsley and plays 65 pretty good snaps.

Patrick's agent must have thought Patrick was strictly an emergency backup type of player. PFF gave him a 48 grade. My eyes tell me he is considerably better than that grade.

OL is Bakh, Jenkins, Linsley, Turner, Patrick, Madison, Light, Nijman, and Leglue (plus Taylor - 59.2 grade - if he isn't cut). Those names scare me. Perhaps they sign Veldheer, but I doubt he is signing for $1.487M.

Perhaps you're on to something. I've seen OC Tyler Biadasz mocked to GB at #30. Not many OCs and OGs in this draft in the top 62.

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stockholder's picture

February 02, 2020 at 08:08 am

PFFs top 100 will change your mind. Especially at center.

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flackcatcher's picture

February 02, 2020 at 07:35 pm

OL is a really tough call for Gute. Outside of Buluga who Gute has publicly stated he wants to resign, the rest is a jump ball. The real question is Linsley expendable. If he is then everything else falls into place. Jenkins goes to center, and Taylor slides to LG. Packers have no replacement for Buluga, as Gute stated by his priority in wanting to resign him. (Not going to be easy. Dissing Buluga in 2018 going to cost. These guys never forget.) Packers already drafted Spriggs as Beluga's replacement, and we all saw how that worked out. One of many tough decisions for Gute...

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MarkinMadison's picture

February 03, 2020 at 07:00 am

TGR's suggestion for filling the RT spot is way more appealing to me than re-signing Bulaga. I'm an Iowa guy. I love Bulaga. With his injury history and his age I just don't see paying him big $$$.

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HankScorpio's picture

February 03, 2020 at 07:23 am

Biadasz is tumbling down draft boards after a poor season. If you see him anywhere near round 1, it is probably because the draft board is not caught up to film from 2019 and based more on lists developed prior to the start of the year.

Cushenberry and Ruiz are the top OCs according to what I'm reading. Both are solid round 2 at this point in the process.

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dobber's picture

February 02, 2020 at 11:20 am

Reasons to keep him: he's still playing well. The financial commitment is in line with (if not below) his performance at his position. Playing out his deal allows the Packers to earn draft compensation. Cutting him creates potentially two holes in the OL (with Bulaga's uncertainty). The money saved would not be enough to replace him on the open market. Failure to replace him through the draft or FA injects a reserve (Patrick or Taylor) into the starting lineup either at G or C, and likely reduces the talent level of the OL.

Another reason to let him go: back problems in 2019. While he never missed time, back problems for OL are never a good thing and don't often go away.

"and trust that you have or can develop a competent LG."

That's worked so well at RG, that I have absolutely NO reservations about doing this. ;)

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CoachDino's picture

February 01, 2020 at 11:19 pm

Wow, Thank-you so much for your Article. This is by far the most thorough, researched, critical thinking and concise analysis of the Packers 2020 offseason I have ever seen to date. Better than paid sites I subscribe too. Thanks again Brother good stuff!! This is an excellent source of reference for us Off Season Junkies going forward.. Love how you're not afraid to incorporate and site substatianting articles...PS .. Conclusions doesn't sound good for signing New High Dollar FA, There are stop gaps and a very deep draft in some critical areas for the pack. I'm still sticking to Best player available, with limited reach. Critical needs only with little other option scenarios.
Sign Bulaga - Draft a OT - 1st 3 rounds. Ben Bacht if he lasts to the3rd. Not sold on it, but if Murray does drop, go for it in RD 1.
Good - Rec will be available at end of round 1 and 2.
There's some nice RB's available late - The cats from Florida and Memphis fit the scheme and bring it.....
ILB is the trickiest as far as I'm concerned. Even if Murray is available (I've seen him from 16 to 50 crazy) he has holes and it's a lot to ask for him to just step in. He does seem like the type of kid that could do it and man he has the tools...

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RobinsonDavis's picture

February 02, 2020 at 12:02 pm

FINALLY!! A well written, well thought-out article on the draft and how the cap works...Thanks, TGR.

As you know, you and I see more things alike than different. However, and please correct me if am wrong, but the OTC calculator uses $206,335,154 as their max cap for comparison which is roughly $6.3 million less the $200 million sited here, thus decreasing your numbers for cap space by the same amount.

We do not have the cap space to do what many would like to see without restructuring contracts for this coming year and releasing others as you thoughtfully present, especially if the Pack wishes to complete Clark's contract this year as Gute suggested. Thus, I am also watching to see if Adams, BakhT, and/or Linsley contracts are also restructured NOW prior to 2021, when we have tons of cap room because of the free agents forementioned. Thank you again!

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 02, 2020 at 09:18 pm

Yes, I noticed OTC's calculator. OTC is assuming a $200M salary cap limit and assuming that GB will have $6.3M to roll over from 2019 into 2020.

I checked the NFLPA public salary report which showed $5.8M available for rollover. Sportrac showed $5.3M. I came out at just over $6M. My personal numbers would mean about $300,000 less in cap space than OTC, but I used OTC's numbers in the article and adjusted any obvious issues.

I actually wrote this article January 26 before OTC updated for Jones and Williams' PPE increase in salary, and AR's escalators, and Bakh's pro bowl escalator. I saved the article and then tweaked it so many times that I learned that there is a time limit (or a limit on how many times one can save an article using the publishing software), and ended up losing the entire article. I wrote this one from scratch with only my spreadsheets still available. Had to look up OTC valuations and PFF grades for all of the free agents. Tedious.

I agree GB doesn't have the cap space to do as much as in 2019. Probably could sign three $10M AAV guys, something like that. Depends on if Gute wants to distort the contract structure or play it straight.

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RobinsonDavis's picture

February 03, 2020 at 08:53 pm

Missed that....Thank you for the clarification and the great article!

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RobinsonDavis's picture

February 02, 2020 at 12:35 pm

Also, your point about the NFLPA negotiations is right on! I wonder if this will change Gute's cap-carry philosophy?

Last, check-out Kwiatkoski's draft 3-cone and shuttle times. Both have been coveted in the past when the Pack looks at LBs and Kwiatkoski's shuttle time was outstanding, displaying his reaction and agility capabilities.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 01:04 pm

What players you can get will determine who you will cut.

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dobber's picture

February 02, 2020 at 08:02 pm

Not always. Since roster bonuses usually pay right at the opening of FA, teams are often going to cut players to avoid vesting that bonus before they know what they're getting on the open market.

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Qoojo's picture

February 02, 2020 at 04:08 pm

This is probably unpopular, but it's time to move from Tramon and go younger and faster if possible.

I would re-sign Crosby to avoid the kicking rollercoaster, but definitely bring in competition.

DL is a priority. Right now it's Clark and the JAGs, which isn't getting it done.

Goodbye Martinez.

I would release Lewis and Graham. But if no suitable blocking TE replacement found, then re-sign Lewis.

I don't think I roll the dice on Bulaga, and I would release him. I really doubt he will be as healthy next year.

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jlc1's picture

February 02, 2020 at 04:11 pm

I say we make sure Murphy is on the management team that negotiates the next contract and that he jumps the cap number to the exact point that the Packers break even. We don't need to put extra money in the owner's pocket like every other franchise so let's leverage the fact of community ownership into a Super Bowl win. Might work elsewhere even.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 06:34 pm

I would release Buluga. It is time !!!! Time to shift the game plan!!! Cut Buluga and go get DT

Hargrave is just 26 years old and has been a solid, productive and consistent defender for Pittsburgh since being picked No. 89 overall in the 2016 NFL draft. During his 63-game career, Hargrave has totaled 168 tackles, 14.5 sacks and 22 tackles for loss.

Pros

J.Hargrave is fresh off of his best year as a Steeler. He played a career-high 62.9% of the team’s defensive snaps and racked up 60 tackles. He was ranked the eighth-best interior defensive lineman by Pro Football Focus. He’s been a force at nose tackle for a Steelers defense that has ranked in the top 15 against the run since 2016. Hargraves’ strength, tenacity and a low center of gravity makes him a perfect fit for a team that struggled immensely against the run last year. He’s also a threat to get to the quarterback. He finished with a 14.2% pressure rate in 2019. That put him third behind Aaron Donald and Chris Jones among all interior linemen.

Cons

Hargrave only played 62.9% of Pittsburgh’s defensive snaps last year and that was a career-high. The question is if he can handle more playing time. If Hargrave wants top money, he will need to prove he can stay on the field more often. Also, this is a strong DT free agent market, so Packers can probably find an alternative at a cheaper price. This is Hargrave’s first opportunity to get a lucrative contract and chances are he won’t be taking a discount.

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CAG123's picture

February 03, 2020 at 02:24 pm

Hargrave doesn’t need to prove he can stay on the field the Steelers have a surplus of DL and run a heavy rotation to keep guys fresh. It’s the reason a guy that would probably be a priority for most teams is a luxury for them and is why they’ll most likely let him walk.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 06:46 pm

Cut Jimmy Graham and go get TE Austin Hooper. Cut M. Lewis , G. Allison, J. Kumerow and B. Martinez and go get WR Amari Cooper or WR Robbie Anderson and ILB.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 06:48 pm

I still say go back to 4-3 Defense and move up P. Smith to DE along with New DT next to Clark and Z. Smith

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 06:55 pm

Cut Tyrone Williams and Jason Spriggs and resign Jared Valdheer OT

1. Draft 1st pick WR
2. Draft 2nd pick LB or OT
3. Draft 3rd Pick CB, LB, RB or OL

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stockholder's picture

February 02, 2020 at 10:41 pm

Draft Wr first. Like Samuel./// Make sure he can get off the Line./// I know Higgins can. // Lot of Greg Jennings comparisons /// LB - Murray and Weaver are two of the slowest ILBs per 40. Harrison is the fastest per un- official times. /// The best. bargain IOL are in the 2nd- 3rd. RTs are available there too. It would be a mistake not to take 2 wr early or 1 of the top 3 RBs in the 2nd. Valdheer would give a rookie tmie to develop. PFF has Jonah Jackson,Ceasar Ruiz, and Cleveland high. I'll take Lemieux. If Curtiss Weaver Edge is there @30 he would be the only defensive player I would take.

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Rossonero's picture

February 03, 2020 at 12:14 pm

Huh? Spriggs was cut a long time ago. I think you mean Tramon Williams? I agree with bringing back Veldheer.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 02, 2020 at 06:55 pm

Go Pack Go!!!!

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Rossonero's picture

February 03, 2020 at 08:45 am

Excellent article. I'd propose cutting Graham and Taylor, and bringing back Bulaga, Tramon Williams (1 year deal) and of course Crosby. Martinez is too expensive and can go.

As far Linsley goes, he's an unsung hero of the O-line. However, he has had back issues. If the Packers know his back isn't quite right -- and back problems certainly don't get better with age and with the life of an NFL Center -- then that might be the signal to make the hard decision to not keep him as well. It obviously leaves a hole in the O-line of course, which would trigger some shuffling around. My hope is that his back is OK of course and that we keep him.

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

February 03, 2020 at 09:31 am

And CUT Montravious Adam's!! Worthless!!!

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Freezn's picture

February 03, 2020 at 09:56 am

I would keep Valdheer release Bulaga, Jimmy Graham Mercedes Lewis, Tremon Williams , Martinez, use the money saved on some free agents and draft to fill some holes with better younger talent we have drafted some talent we have not seen yet like our fast rookie linebacker Ty summers. I believe we do have some good young talent

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Matt Gonzales's picture

February 03, 2020 at 12:44 pm

Veldheer has the same type of injury history as Bulaga and is older. Extending Bulaga is more expensive but probably safer and gives them another year or two to find the next long term solution.

Cutting Graham makes total sense. So does bringing jug Lewis back, unless they think they can get that kind of blocking out of Vitale.

I think Linsley is a cap casualty this offseason, and there are two possible replacements on the roster today.

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TXCHEESE's picture

February 03, 2020 at 04:09 pm

I could be completely wrong, but I believe Bulaga will bend a bit in order to stay in GB. He's seen the other side of this with Lang and Sitton. Any young talented tackle is not going to want to sign for anywhere near what I believe Bulaga would stay for. Draft some OL and continue to develop what you have. I've always wondered if Linsley wouldn't be better suited at guard instead of center. Graham should be gone yesterday. Time for youth to be served in the TE room.

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bizz888's picture

February 29, 2020 at 08:49 am

Rodgers always tells it like it is, which is why he is one of the most respected QB's in the league
https://www.sincitystucco.com/

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