Packers Snap Counts Versus The Saints

Jordan Love shows that perhaps he can come in a win games for the Packers.  Several other Packers make a bid for a roster spot.

After scrimmaging twice against the Saints, the Packers played a preseason game against them on Friday.  There were 63 plays on offense and 63 plays on defense.  

Player Snaps % % SF STs
Hanson 57 90 79 1-4%
Van Laanen 46 73 35 3-12%
Tom 40 63 49 3-12%
Nijman 36 57 65 3-12%
Newman 36 57 65 3-12%
Rhyan 27 43 34 4-16%
Caleb Jones 27 43 35 1-4%
Myers 17 27 51 1-4%
Runyan 17 27 65 1-4%
Menet 6 10 21 1-4%
Clary 6 10 1 1-4%
         
Love 57 90 65  
Etling 6 10 35  
         
Goodson 32 51 41 10-40%
P Taylor 18 29 27 9-36%
D Williams 13 24 - 6-24%
         
A Mack 30 48 34 11-44%
T Davis 24 38 37 5-20%
Deguara 12 19 46 1-4%
Becker 9 14 -  
Cannela 5 8 11 4-16%
         
A Rodgers 46 73 75 8-32%
Winfree 44 70 41 2-8%
Toure 33 52 62 12-48%
Doubs 29 46 39  
Fulgham 11 17 -  
Hyman 9 14 21 1-4%
         
27 on Offense        

The Packers rolled out Nijman, Runyan, Myers, Hanson, and Newman to start the game.  Runyan and Myers were pulled after the first two series (17 snaps), with the Packers in the lead, 3-0.  Hanson moved to center, and Van Laanen came in to play left guard, where he got an extremely long look.  I had not realized Van Laanen played so many snaps, which I suppose is a good sign for an offensive lineman.  Newman had a rougher outing.  PFF assigned two pressures and two more lost reps on passing plays in Newman's 19 pass blocking snaps. 

The Packers scored a touchdown on their third third possession, an 11-play drive resuscitated by a roughing the passer penalty.  The Packers got the ball back after Shawn Davis recovered a botched snaps and returned it to New Orlean's 25-yard line.  After a nice 5-yard run by Patrick Taylor and two incomplete passes, the Packers kicked a field goal.  After Abernathy intercepted a pass, the Packers ran 2 plays with that possession ending on Tyler Davis' fumble. 

Tyler Goodson ran the ball five times for 38 yards (7.6 yard average) with a long of 15.  Patrick Taylor picked up some tough yards inside, carrying the ball 8 times for 27 yards, with a long of 5.  Taylor also had a very nice play in pass protection, and was very good on special teams.  Amari Rodgers ran a reverse for 8 yards, showing enough speed to get to the edge.  The Packers averaged 5.21 yards per rush from non-quarterbacks.

It appears to me that of their potential starters, the Saints played only DT Shy Tuttle (11 snaps), LB Kayden Eliss (30 snaps).  CB Bradley Roby (10 snaps) might see some playing time. On offense, the Saints played likely starting right guard Cesar Ruiz for 31 snaps.  It seems safe to believe that the Packers played more against the Saints' starters in the two scrimmages.

In the second half, the Packers featured an offensive line of Caleb Jones, Van Laanen, Hanson, Rhyan and Tom.  Goodson had 2 carries for 4 yards.  Dexter Williams ran it 5 times for 24 yards (4.8 yard average), and Amari Rodgers had a 7-yard run with Hyman adding an eleven yard run.  Toure lost 2 yards on his attempt.  Caleb Jones absolutely pancaked Saints on more than one occasion.  The thought that perhaps Jones might not pass through waivers flickered through my mind.  Rhyan seemed up and down.  Zach Tom threw a couple of nice run blocks.  PFF indicated that he did not allow a pressure in 19 pass blocking snaps.  Some fans apparently thought Tom gave up too much ground in those pass blocking snaps; that is a matter of opinion.  I thought Clary played some nice snaps.  Rasheed Walker did not play, once again.

Tyler Davis had anothe brutal night with a fumble and a holding penalty that negated a 17-yard reception to Doubs.  None of the other tight ends did much.  Deguara had an 11-yard reception in 12 snaps, Sal Cannela caught a 13 yard pass, and newcomer Nate Becker caught a 2-yard pass.  Alize Mack had no statisitcs.  

Winfree led the day with 41 receiving yards on 3 catches (6 targets).  He also had some nice blocks.  Doubs caught 3 passes for 24 yards with a long of 17, and had another 17-yard reception wiped out by Tyler Davis' holding penalty.  He dropped his other two targets, one of which was an over the shoulder attempt that would have been a fairly long reception.  Doubs can get open, and he can get separation, but he drops too many.  He did catch a beautiful touchdown pass from Love.  Amari Rodgers caught two of five targets for 5 yards.  I do wonder if he has to be schemed open as he does not appear to get open downfield often.  He did make a nice adjustment on a pass over the middle but the ball popped out as he hit the ground.  

Jordan Love played well.  He was more accurate.  Some thought he felt some phantom pressure that was not there, but it is hard to separate Love derangement syndrome from neutral appraisals.  Once again his box score of 12 of 24 for 113 yards and a touchdown is misleading.  His receivers dropped at least 4 passes that PFF noted were worth 71 more air yards plus whatever yards after the catch his receivers might have added.  He moved the team.  The Packers only converted 2 of 5 third down opportunities with Love at the helm, but at least two more should have been converted without the drops.  Etling can run.

As for the differentials in snap percentages between game one and two, Van Laanen getting a long look was interesting, as was Fulgham and Becker playing as much as they did.  The Packers could have taken a longer look at Hyman and Canella, instead.

 

PLAYER SNAPS % % SF STs
Jean-Charles 52 83 66 7-28%
S. Davis 48 76 42 6-24%
K Thomas 45 71 61 13-52%
Abernathy 40 63 - 14-56%
Gafford 35 56 41 3-12%
Scott 23 37 25 5-20%
Ento 21 33 58 12-48%
Cross 15 24 - 5-20%
Nixon 12 19 27 1-4%
Carpenter 0 0 59  
         
Enagbare 34 54 76 10-40%
Wilborn 33 52 51 13-52%
Summers 32 51 34 18-72%
Kobe Jones 28 44 61 14-56%
Hamilton 24 38 Inj 7-28%
McDuffie 24 38 44 2-8%
Gileai 22 35 15 7-28%
Barnes 19 30 20 2-8%
Manac 15 24 29 1-4%
Q Walker 12 19 20 2-8%
Garvin 7 11 19 4-16%
         
Slayton 45 71 86 2-8% 
Heflin 39 62 63 3-12%
Ford 29 46 53 2-8%
Wyatt 26 41 DNP 1-4%
Slaton 14 21 32 4-16%
Byers 0 0 29  
         
24 on Defense        
         
Ahmed       9-36
Coco       8-32
O'Donnell       8-32
         

 

DT Chris Slaton had a nice night with 5 tackles, (3 solo) and a stuff.  Heflin and Slaton were fairly quiet, though they were stout.  Wyatt failed to produce a pressure in 15 pass rushing attempts and was not great against the run.  Ford was not as stout as one would like against double teams.  

McDuffie looks like ILB #3 with 6 tackles (4 solo).  Ray Wilborn was active.  He had 7 tackles (6 solo) and a sack.  Barnes ranged over to make a nice tackle on a pass in the flat to limit the gain but also got washed out by a lineman on a long running play.  PFF suggested that Barnes would be their highest graded defender.  Ty Summers had 4 tackles including a tackle for loss.  The backup OLBs were quiet after being very disruptive in the scrimmages.  Enagbare had several pressures though he finished with just one assisted tackle.  Hamilton has a quarterback hit and 3 tackles (1 solo).  Gilaeai had no statistics but probably had a pressure or two.  Saints QB Ian Book was only pressured 8 times, per PFF.      

Jean-Charles and Kiondre Thomas did not allow a reception.  Thomas added 5 tackles (4 solo).  The Saints did not play Michael Thomas or Jarvis Landry, and rookie Chris Olave played 20 snaps (running 11 routes).  He caught two passes for 28 yards.  Micah Abernathy made several splash plays.  He had a beautiful diving interception and later came up to stuff a little pass in the flat for a loss of 5 yards to force a punt.   

The defense held New Orleans to 10 points.  Ian Book went 16 of 28 for 113 yards (4.03 yards per attempt) and a passer rating of 63.  The Saints ran the ball for 84 yards on 20 attempt (4.2 yard average) but Ian Book scrambled for 49 more yards on 7 rushes.  It was a pretty solid defensive outing, overall.  

The Packers allowed kickoff returns of 59, 27, 26, and 25 yards and a 15-yard punt return.  The Packers did manage a 14-yard punt return by Hyman and a 9-yard return by Amari Rodgers.  The new kicker made his 45 yard attempt and connected from 25 yards as well.  O'Donnell punted well, averaging 48.8 gross and 45.0 net, with 3 inside the twenty-yard line.

As far differentials in playing time between game one and two, Carpenter did not play.  Vernon Scott left early with an injury, either a shoulder or possibly a pectoral problem.  Byers has a toe injury.  I wondered if the Packers were giving Summers one last long look, but that might just be me.  I am surprised that again Nixon did not play many special teams snaps.

 

 

 

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9 points

Comments (79)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
ShawnO's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:08 am

Jordan love still looks like a backup QB, nothing more.

-13 points
3
16
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:17 am

I could have used a photo of Tyler Davis since my purpose in writing these articles is to highlight any player making a bid for the 53, and even for the PS, but also noting who is doing their best to play themselves off the team. Anyway, went positive with Jordan Love. Thought about Tyler Goodson, Abernathy, Caleb Jones (I couldn't find a photo of him playing in last night's game - a parameter I have to follow - or you all would have seen his smiling, or perhaps snarling, face), and Jean-Charles and Kiondre Thomas were not undeserving, but I'd like to see them battle starting WRs more. Winfree was one of my pre-camp dark horses to make the 53, and he has been making a push. Patrick Taylor doing the dirty work, and doing it well. Heflin continues to be stout; he drew a holding penalty even if his stats were not much to write him about, and confusion as to whether he was supposed to be on the field burned a timeout. IDK who put that blame on. Wyatt did diddly squat. He has some twitch - is he going to be a fine pass rusher who is stout enough against the run? DL often take a year. He is worth keeping an eye on.

3 points
4
1
Johnblood27's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:59 am

Thanks TGR!

I thought that Winfree helped his chances.
Obviously Davis put on roller skates on his downhill trajectory off the team.
Doubs looked like a very promising rookie. inconsistent but valuable contributions.
Van Lanen looks to be heading on to another career.
Big Cale looked like he belongs, just a little choppy.
Goodson looks like an explosive guy with the ball in his hands, he is this camps Hill.
Taylor provides needed value, but is it valuable enough for a 53 birth?
I am officially disappointed with Rhyan.
Summers is all but gone.
Wilborn is a numbers victim with 4 ahead of him in a 4 deep position group - PS.
OLB disappointed across the board after a lot of hype from the practices.
Slayton and Heflin look a LOT better than Wyatt.
Ford is a PS lock if he clears waivers.
O'Donnell can kick the durn ball, he is an upgrade.
Tonyan better hurry back and he better be the 2020 version, the position needs it.
Amari Rodgers looks eminently cuttable.
Where was Nixon? Is he a roster lock for ST?

Starters might get some PT next week!

4 points
4
0
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:40 am

Big thanks TGR!

1 points
1
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LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:50 pm

Pretty sure Mack didn't even have a target. It will be interesting to see what PFF thought about his blocking.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 09:46 am

Not much. Mack was their second lowest offensive grade after Davis. Since he had no targets, that’s due to blocking presumably.

They thought a lot of Becker’s blocking, giving him an elite grade for that. Could Becker be an out of nowhere savior?

I don’t always trust PFF, sometimes they beggar logic because they don’t capture the issue (they love Tom at RT), but on TE blocking they are a decent indicator.

0 points
0
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:26 am

I couldn’t help myself from comparing the TD catch by Doubs to Adams. His footwork, body control and catching the ball at the high point are all reminiscent of how Adams would make that play. I’m not saying he will be another Adams, but in that one play he looked the same. He is special player and one who will frustrate us with his drops this year. As with many WR’s who have drops early in their careers I suspect he will learn techniques and focus in time. I just can’t see how he lasted till late in the 4th.

8 points
8
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:38 am

The highs with Doubs are really high. He consistently got separation in practices and is beating press in the scrimmages and games. He can probably play some X. We knew he could play Y and Z. He has to be on the field a ton despite AR's predilections.

First practice I attended I watched Goodson make one cut and just exclaimed aloud: whoa. Guess he has some issues with pass pro and allegedly with going down too easily, but his hands are 100% natural. I don't know if he can run routes or if all he's done is stuff out of the backfield. Either way, his hands are really good.

Carpenter is injured. Ooops. Wish these games would feature the other teams' starters more. No front line WRs, and no Cam Jordan or Davenport, so how to judge the DBs and Caleb Jones/ Zach Tom? PFF thought RG Cesar Ruiz had a good night pass blocking. Well, he is the only starter who played, so while our DL looked good, they didn't smudge the opponent's starter. Lot of time left for Jenkins and even Bakh to get back on the field. 22 days to game one. That 3 week ramp-up period after IR and PUP is there for a reason, and both Jenkins and Bakh still have that time frame in which to recover their full health.

[Edited this for grammar. IDK what my problem was last night: I started writing this at 3:00 AM and didn't finish until 9 AM. Had a heck of a time trying to work out the snaps for the starting OL, that is, seeing when folks left and others entered the game.]

8 points
8
0
jont's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:33 pm

Started at 3.
I was wondering how much time went into this. Really appreciate the effort. Always good stuff.

3 points
3
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LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:52 pm

Thanks for work TGR. Just curious, where do find snap counts for preseason games?

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 09:59 am

Packers website has a stat sheet, the “game book”. That gives most of the info but not the total snaps. Usually it answers all I want to see. I think footballoutsiders.com compiles them for subscribers along with a ton of analytics.

0 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:42 am

Murf,
Ever since the Friday Night Scrimmage I too have been thinking Doubs reminds me of Adams. His footwork and how he can separate at the life of scrimmage. The way he high points catches. Like you I am not saying he is going to be another Adams but boy a lot of his game reminds me of Adams.

Wouldn't the above be nice and Watson's game reminds us of James Lofton. :)

3 points
3
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:44 am

Time to stop the Tom-foolery. No player that can be pushed that far that often has any business pretending they will stand up in the regular season. Caleb Jones was again impressive and stout. Stop this nonsense. Jones at RT and let Newman focus on being a G. He needs reps there and to settle.

Tyler Davis is just not what we hoped. Another terrible drop and poor for the rest of his snaps. We probably need to acquire a TE: that supposedly key role as the all purpose TE is not filled at this point.

Amari Rodgers just isn’t a receiver in the true sense. Time to stop that delusion as well. He’s a gadget player and likely always will be. Play Goodson, who impressed as a RB last night, in that role. Rodgers is a poor fit and not worth the pick. Learn and move on. Goodson has better hands, a bigger radius, is faster and as elusive and can run out of the backfield. I think Taylor’s running in our 20, pass protection and key ST plays pretty much make him a lock now. This way we keep both.

We need to keep Slayton. Heflin arguably too, but a trade if Lowry for or to free cap for a TE is looking more enticing. Ento should be in consideration and was a plus in STs. Looks to have learned to tackle.

Summers just doesn’t have instincts. Wilborn looks almost as challenged. I’d keep Galeai as a ST & DPR guy over both despite getting washed out as a rusher too often. A bad night for OLBs. Hamilton was the only one who may have helped himself somewhat.

If Scott is out for a while, we need a cover S. Could that be Abernathy? It’s certainly not Davis.

I would really really like to see Love with the starting skill players. Other than Winfree, none of the receivers last night showed consistency. Other than Caleb Jones, the O line in the second half was too poor as well. Rhyan did not have a good night.

I really tried to watch Hanson. I really tried to see what makes him a capable G. I couldn’t see it. I thought he was poor at C too. I’m off the fence in him. As with Rodgers, Tom and T Davis, I think the Packers are deluding themselves. It’s a bit of a worrying trend. I’m a little worried that LaFleur has come to believe his own hype.

I thought Love looked good in the first half. I think I see why they took him out after the first half the week before. We might as well have had Etling in. That group was that poor.

Next week let’s see Newman at G, Jones at RT. Tom can go to the weight room. That’s the place that he’s most likely doing the most to protect Rodgers. If I were Gute, I’d be looking for a partner to trade for a TE. I was hoping Mack would show up, but he didn’t. Then let’s replace Amari with Goodson. He couldn’t be any less versatile.

7 points
11
4
PackyCheese500's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:01 am

I’d like to see Jones at RT too. He should make the roster over other guys like CVL. Newman actually put on some weight this off-season to be better suited to Guard, and I don’t want him at RT. However, according to PFF, Tom didn’t allow a pressure this week or last. He could use some time in the weight room, but he’s got exciting potential. I think the potential for Amari to become a quality WR is definitely there, he just needs some more work. He looked abysmal last year, and already is looking better, so there’s no reason he couldn’t become a quality WR maybe next year. He has great YAC ability too.I don’t agree with the refs call of overturning his catch. I don’t think the Packers should trade Lowry, they already have about 3m in cap space and he had 5 sacks last season. Tongan is also returning, Deguara looks better, and they still have Lewis, so they shouldn’t need a TE. The d line tonight (and OLBs) were not consistent at all, and I think they should sign Jason Pierre Paul with their remaining cap space. I think the excitement with Rodgers and Tom is reasonable, but not T Davis. Abernathy could be a good depth piece at S. Goodson was awesome, and Taylor solid with some good blocks too.

3 points
5
2
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:13 am

LOL. The line I put in the article about Tom giving up too much ground was a nod in your general direction, CW. There were others who mentioned it and I noticed how deep into the backfield Tom ended up being on several occasions.

I think it is time to move into a more anti-Amari mode. He is faster and quicker this year, but I don't see extraordinary speed or quickness, and he is tiny. I guess folks think he can make things happen in the open field, but he has to get there. I have not seen any evidence that he can get open downfield as a receiver. Hands seem less than acceptable. Judgment as well. I found myself being annoyed that the coaching staff so obviously has just handed him the punt return duties. Promoting competition is the job of government and coaching staffs.

Not ready to go out on a limb for Caleb Jones, but I am inching towards some more slender branches. Not clear to me that he's faced Gary and Preston in camp much, or anyone of starting quality in these preseason games. I think he did do pretty well in the scrimmages. His feet look good to me, but I am not really a judge of OL.

I alluded to Summers being close to the edge in the article. I think they took a last long look tonight. I don't see any reason to keep a 5th ILB, especially if it is Wilborn. No trouble getting Wilborn or Summers to the PS, I shouldn't think, except that supposedly Summers is good on STs. Someone might snap him, but more likely half way through the season after some other team sustains an injury to one of the LB types on STs.

Newman isn't an OT. Steno had fun with Tom but I think the Packers would have been better off having him take snaps only at OC with some at OT in case of emergency duty.

5 points
5
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:49 am

Tom has potential if he can add mass and power, but when he’s driven like that by back ups and without anything but a vanilla rush it’s foolish to not see the obvious. Any DC will have and he will get Rodgers hurt at this point. I put little confidence in pass protection at this point. As we saw with Newman last year, they aren’t protecting against the best and those they are facing aren’t attacking weaknesses. At this point Tom has no business being on the field. That was all too clearly shown last night.

4 points
4
0
LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:58 pm

Fennell really liked the work Tom put in. I know he was high on him before the draft but I trust his judgement on the big guys, all guys actually.

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 10:17 am

Over the years I’ve come to realize that those guys aren’t always right and that they too see things through lenses. I’m not saying that I’m always right either. For every Rodgers and Adams there’s a Moore in my closet.

However, when I see a consistent trend repeating that screams opportunities for opponents and teams not really trying to exploit it in preseason, then I doubt the stats and opinions that ignore it are very reliable predictors.

Let’s see what happens this week. If PFF and Fennell are even close to being right, then the Packers no longer have any reason to play Newman at T. It will be Tom all the way because he would have earned their confidence rightly for the second week running. If the Packers do not, then I think you can infer that they too see reasons to doubt those takes, as I very much do.

1 points
1
0
PackyCheese500's picture

August 20, 2022 at 05:44 pm

Tom does definitely need more muscle mass, but according to PFF, he didn’t allow a pressure (this week or last). He definitely has great potential, and I would prefer him over Newman at RT (Newman actulally gained weight this off-season to be a better guard so I don’t want him at tackle). Why should we be more anti-Amari? He has made big strides this off-season compared to last year, and there’s no reason he can’t take another leap next year and become a better WR. Jones should make the roster over other guys like CVL. He is an exciting prospect and could become another Yosh-type player

0 points
1
1
Guam's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:54 pm

I thought CVL had a decent game, particularly in run blocking. He and Nijman/Jones opened some good running lanes on the left side of the line. His pass blocking was also adequate. I think CVL helped himself with this game. To be clear, CVL is a guard in the NFL. He does not have the athleticism to play tackle.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 05:45 pm

He’s surprised me and he’s played every position but C I think. I really think they are trying to boost Hanson to cover for not training Tom at C. Right now CVL looks better than Hanson at G to me. Cant really fathom their handling of this, but I think had Tom trained at C, Hanson would be behind CVL. CVL hasn’t looked too bad as a fill in T. I’d put him at least on a par with Newman. As a starter? No, I agree.

0 points
0
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:14 am

With the play of TJ and Heflin, Lowry might be an odd man out by either trading him or releasing him (utilize his SC savings) and pick up some depth at positions of needs. The cuts are coming and there will be some SC saving good players available. TE might be one of them, we could use a good 4th with Lewis, Tonyan and Deguara.

As a side note, our 4th and 5th round draft picks might just be some of the better steals of the draft. Both were predicted higher at one point and dropped closer to the draft day.

4 points
5
1
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:41 am

CW, I wouldn’t put Caleb Jones at RT, he will get smoked by flexible, quick pass rushers. He needs better footwork and technique. His size can be a plus, but also a curse. There’s a reason not many tackles at 6’9 and 350+ Are in the NFL. I’m no expert in evaluation of OL, but it seems he needs polishing. I noticed when he tried to move and run block, the defender juked him and made a tackle for a loss. That type of play will get you to the bench quickly.

Keep in mind, the players he was going against were players that won’t make NO’s team or get very little playing time. I think he has potential, but if you throw him into the fire against #1’s, he will struggle with consistency.

5 points
6
1
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:50 am

Maybe time to call Caleb Jones 'Too Tall Jones!'

Whatya all think? :)

Wow....that has been almost 50-years now hasn't it? This is the Nickname!

Wonder if Too Tall Jones drops to say 350 lbs what that might do for his quickness? Looks like he could use some weight room work but that might just be because he is such a long armed guy. I think RT is the place for him.

4 points
4
0
stockholder's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:48 pm

Too Tall- Nice. He lost weight already. It made him faster. Yet the balance still may be long term. He's PS for sure. Will learn more about his weight and Balance from there.

1 points
1
0
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:35 pm

SH,
I know he has lost weight and I don't know what his ideal weight is for 6'9" but 370 lbs seems pretty heavy yet. Wonder if 350 lbs might be more appropriate?

0 points
0
0
jont's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:41 pm

"Maybe time to call Caleb Jones 'Too Tall Jones!'
Whatya all think? :)"

Too Tall Jones II

4 points
4
0
Turophile's picture

August 21, 2022 at 10:44 am

Too Tall 2

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:57 am

Murf, I am not anointing him as a long term starter at RT. I am saying that he is a better option than Newman or Tom currently. One reason is that he looks good in the run game, but the clincher last night was watching his feet. They aren’t slow.

That was a surprise. That was a big knock on him. Then again, he was rumored to have been playing at over 400 pounds in college (he was listed at 368). That will slow feet. Go back and watch if you have the chance. Then watch where Tom ends up on a lot of plays.

3 points
3
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:48 pm

Sorry CW, I thought you were saying he should start at RT this year. I did watch him again this morning, and I see potential. I will look at Tom and draw an opinion. Just watching live is too hard to evaluate, especially while imbibing in a few beverages with friends. I think you would agree, if there isn't a good candidate on the team for RT, they wouldn't start CJ right now, they would pick up a Vet first.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:22 pm

Jones is a prospect I think a lot more of now than I did in July, but he should be developed. That said, I think right now, with what we have actually game available, he is the best fill in option.

I cannot for the life of me see why they are as high on Hanson as they are, and a few weeks ago I was saying let’s not leap to conclusions on him. He was not good at C in the second half either. I think CVL is better at G (and I was not a fan if his either).

I’ve noticed Tom being pushed around for a while, but last night it was extraordinary. He’s got nice feet but leaves gaps you could literally drive a bus through at times. Come real football the fact that his man isn’t getting to Rodgers won’t matter because others will be, easily. That’s how I see it watching twice. Sometimes you have to watch and think about stats. This is one where I think that they are dangerously misleading. I’d hate to be the guard on the inside of him.

2 points
2
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 01:58 pm

I just watched all of Tom's 40 plays and I'm not seeing what you are. He didn't have any bad Pass blocking and he was far more agile in run blocking. He's more athletic. You can see it when they are pulling to run block. CJ is slower and not as quick. Like CJ, Tom did whiff on a run block. They both pass blocked well, due to his footwork, I thought Tom was better. I would play Tom before Caleb Jones.

Tom is also a Player I wanted the Packers to draft so maybe I'm bias.

0 points
1
1
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:34 pm

I didn’t have a particular feeling for or against Tom being drafted. My initial feeling was that he could be good as a C now and work on physical development. I was surprised how good he looked at T in shorts. Reminded me of Spriggs a bit when the pads went on though. And it’s just got more so. Now he could be good (he’s not Spriggs) with more functional power and maybe mass, though his frame seems less able to support that than Bakh’s did. But It isn’t adequate yet

Jones came in with a reputation as big and slow footed. It’s true that he’s not a dancer like Tom. But last night I was watching and, honestly, he really surprised me how not slow he or his feet are. That perhaps explains why they’ve started to try him at LT having initially had him at right. But still, the weight loss makes him look like a different beast. Still work to be done, but he gets it done. Time to see if he can on the right verses the firsts (Or at least the best out there).

Jones did really well in the scrimmage too. To put this in perspective, Tom can’t beat out Newman and that’s not a ringing endorsement. The experiment doesn’t look to be helping Newman as a G either. If the alternative is Hanson, I think we’d be wise to let him settle there. Tom hasn’t enabled that, perhaps Jones can hold the fort till Jenkins.

1 points
1
0
dobber's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:59 am

Vey likely that, if kept and he ended up on the field, Jones would have a TE lining up on his shoulder a lot. If he's a liability against speed, DCs will target that when he's on the field whether he's on the right or left side. Guys with his size and wingspan take time to get around, though.

5 points
5
0
stockholder's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:04 pm

No - You don't give up on Tom yet. Jones had a weight problem. ( He looks good now, But-) Newman at G. is all I can agree with.
Need to move on from Davis @ TE.
Amari Rodgers is better than keeping a Lousy TE. I said all Along. That an OT could block, and Lazard could play it in a pinch.
Keep Lowrey! Dump Heflin.
Keep Summers for Sts. And if a ILB goes down. His experience still gives us a chance. WE had worse!
Safety still is a problem. Abernathy needs more snaps.
More Etling! Love started out good then melted.
Goodson made this club until Hill is ready.
And Newman must start at Guard if he's going to be long term.

-2 points
2
4
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:36 pm

SH,
Looking for your objective view of Love after last nights game. I know a small sample size but are you willing yet to acknowledge Love is improving and looking pretty good?

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:37 pm

Jones did have a weight problem. His father owns the kind of restaurant that might give us all one apparently. We will have to watch him for that, but he’s undoubtedly reshaped his body. It’s made him a lot faster.

2 points
2
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ckoski's picture

August 21, 2022 at 08:43 am

The guy is 370 pounds and does not look overweight. A crazy physical specimen.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 05:38 pm

Nijman is supposedly 2 inches shorter and 314. He’s pretty lean too, just very powerful. I look at Jones and I think about Bakh after the first couple of years bulking up, not just now that he’s 30. Jones looks trimmer than that. I certainly can’t guarantee that he holds his physique, but I certainly don’t think he looks 20 pounds overweight, as some seem to think. Looks in photos and in film can be deceiving, but he’s just a massive frame as well as a huge man I think.

0 points
0
0
NJ-RICK's picture

August 20, 2022 at 03:12 pm

I've been saying it for years trade D Lowry... Horrible against the run. Better pass rusher but paying him to much for the amount he plays. Another bone headed move but Gute. Ty Summer should be long gone by now... Hard to grade many of these players there all going up against 2nd tier players. Packers should start some 1st string offense and defense players on Thursday against the Chiefs....

-1 points
1
2
PackyCheese500's picture

August 20, 2022 at 05:58 pm

I agree Lowry is worth too much, but the Packers are still better with than without him. In what could be A Rods final year, I think we should embrace our deep d line rather than trade it away. He had a career year last season, too, and the benefits of him staying I think outweigh the costs. Besides, he wouldn’t get more than a third round pick at the VERY most in a trade.

3 points
3
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Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 10:10 am

The Packers are not better without Lowry if that the extent of the analysis. The fact is though that he is the only individual who offers notable cap savings and might be trade-able and we could perhaps have a chance to get better overall by using that to acquire (for example) a TE.

Could the degree of difference between Heflin/Slayton instead of Lowry be outweighed by the difference between T Davis and another TE? If Bakh is looking less likely, could getting a vet there outweigh the downgrade at DE?

I think the answer is yes. It is quite conceivable that an opportunity arises where the loss at DE makes the team better. If that arises I doubt Gute will hesitate. Is it the probable outcome? No, but it’s a rational possibility.

1 points
1
0
PackyCheese500's picture

August 21, 2022 at 03:21 pm

The Packers already have 3m in cap space. They don’t need more to spend on a a dried up free agent market. Besides, in addition to the 3m they have, Gutey always keeps 5m of in-season cap space that he can spend. We don’t need more. Yosh is probably as good as any other veteran still available out there, and EJ will be back soon. Bakh was also activated today, so the OL is looking up. They also have Tom as a desperation move. Getting a 4th tight end is not worth it because the Packers already have a good pass catcher (Tonyan), blocker (Lewis), and fullback (Deguara). The TE draft and free agent market in 2023 is also very good. If anything, the Packers should use their 3m in cap space to sign a veteran EDGE, like Jason Pierre-Paul. The depth there is a bit concerning. Having Lowry would help, because he provides an additional source of pressure. Plus, Slayton and Heflin have little experience and have not done great in actual games. The draft capital from a Lowry trade would not be great either, at VERY most a third round pick but probably something like a fourth-fifth rounder is more realistic. Not worth it, in my opinion.

0 points
0
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Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 04:34 pm

That cap space has to address injury settlements and inseason need signings that inevitably happen each year. That’s why we may need extra to sign anyone not on minimum.

Tonyan, once back and truly to form is a move guy and that is what we want him doing. Deguara us an H back who is better lead blocking and of a different physique. Lewis at this point is primarily an excellent in line blocker who can leak out for the odd catch. He’s not going to play a huge number of snaps.

Davis was supposed to be the pivotal TE that has been missing. Why pivotal? Because he’s the guy that allows deception. He’s the one who can block, leading or in line, and has the speed and hands ability to be a real part of the pass game in any play. That’s critical to any illusion of complexity or misdirection and options out of certain formations.

Davis seemed to be going to fit that bill nicely. He blocked well last year and flashed in the passing game and then … August came and he hasn’t been able to block or catch. I have no clue what has happened to him or why, but he’s not looking like a player. They will now likely want to replace him if they can and they will want a player who has experience. TE is one of the most difficult positions to master and requires a lot of playbook knowledge.

That is why trading could perhaps be deemed a necessary option and why we might need more cap to achieve it.

On a very limited sample Becker had a good game on Friday. He can block and he did catch a pass I think. He does not look as athletic as Davis, but he might just be athletic enough to represent another option. That would mean we don’t have to trade for a TE. Of course they might see an edge or a G or whomever that has enough merit in their eyes that requires more cap to acquire or Becker may not be adequate either, though a guy Gute loves could get waived too. Trading Lowry remains a real possibility IF Gute feels we need a specific available player enough at above minimum cap hit.

0 points
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0
PackyCheese500's picture

August 23, 2022 at 08:45 pm

If you look at Over The Cap, the Packers have about 16m in cap space. However, if you look at Ken Ingalls’ analysis, he sets aside cap space for this like injury settlements, PS elevations, AND a 5-mil in-season piggy bank In addition to all this, the Packers have 3m of cap space to play with. They’ve got more than enough to conduct TE experiments. In my opinion, the Packers should have kept Dafney, but I like what little I’ve seen of Becker and I want to see more vs the Chiefs. In addition, any draft capital acquired from a Lowry trade wouldn’t be worth his production in what very well could be ARods final year. It is actually the front 7 that needs the most depth help, and I think the best move for the Packers would be to sign Jason Pierre Paul with the free 3m they have to be a backup OLB. Outside of Gary and Smith, the Packers couldn’t pressure the QB last year, and that was evident in the Saints game too. Having a veteran OLB presence improved the overall play of the defense last year as was seen with Mercilus, and Pierre Paul is better than he.

0 points
0
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:50 am

I would agree with PFF on Barnes play, he was all over the field making plays. I mentioned his play to a buddy a couple of times during the game. I think it’s close between McDuffie and him on who wins the #3 ILB position. I think Barnes wins it due to his experience running the D. Summers is an odd man out unless they keep 5 or because they love his ST play.

TJ Slayton is improving and looks like he will help quite a bit this year at Nose. Not sure what to think about Chris Slaton, he makes plays, but I don’t suspect there is room for him. If eligible, he will go to PS.

I really liked the way Love played in the first half, he started out quick and kept it going. The drops are hurting his stats, but that’s not what I concentrate on in his evaluation. 2nd half was a different story, but I also have to wonder how you rate a person when playing with many players who won’t make the team and in the rain.

7 points
7
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:22 am

Um, this is confusing. It is Chris Slayton and TJ Slaton (no Y). Chris is 304 pounds. He can perhaps play nose but looks like a 3T as well. TJ is 330 pounds. He can definitely play nose. It looks like he has more quickness than expected and might be disruptive, but I expect him to play zero technique to 2i. TJ Slaton is a lock. Chris Slayton is on the bubble. Both had good nights Friday but Chris Slayton played more and had more stats with a couple of nice run stops.

6 points
6
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:22 am

Duplicate. Fat fingers or just tired.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:02 pm

I agree on Barnes. He made some good plays in coverage too and showed anticipation. A pleasant surprise.

I really want to see Slayton given a chance against better players. Right now I see why he’s surpassed Ford. Can he do that against starters? Hefflin too. He just keeps getting it done. Why not give them a run in practice? What’s to lose?

3 points
3
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PackyCheese500's picture

August 21, 2022 at 03:31 pm

Me too. With Lowry and Reed likely leaving in free agency next year, the Packers should see if they can become quality role players.

0 points
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0
PackEyedOptimist's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:36 am

I was at the game last night, and my impressions match many of those above.
Caleb Jones stood out, especially on run blocks. Barnes looked good.
Coldworld: "Summers just doesn’t have instincts. " That's exactly what I was going to say! He often went to the wrong hole or took the wrong angle chasing players. McDuffie looked much better in that regard.
I completely agree with CW that I'd rather keep Goodson over Amari as the gadget player.
Toure had a rough night along with Tyler Davis(again), but I won't be surprised if they make the roster.
Chris Slayton is sort of like Heflin last year--hard to cut a guy that keeps making plays.
Jean-Charles is looking like an upgrade from Chandon Sullivan and Henry Black.
Cannela only had five snaps, but looked pretty good.
Love looks like a pro QB. He threw some really good passes.

7 points
7
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 10:47 am

Pack, Caleb did have a good run block, but he also whiffed and looked silly while trying to block a LB which ended in a tackle for loss or at the LOS. Consistency will be his problem at this stage of his career IMO. I’m not sold on him yet, certainly not as a starter.

0 points
1
1
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:13 am

The issue for me is deciding whether GB can slide him through waivers and onto the PS. Most of the time these guys sail through waivers without an issue despite some hand-wringing by fans like me. [Perhaps Gute gets a wee bit nervous about it, as well. LOL]

Caleb might also see Bakh, Jenkins, and Nijman ahead of him, and he might also think that GB seems to like Tom as an OT as well. GB has tried CVL and Newman there as well. Maybe the coaching/teaching prowess and reputation sways him to stay with GB, but once these guys are placed on waivers and clear it, they are unrestricted free agents. Once in a while a guy has decided he can develop on another team's PS and have a better or clearer path to their 53 elsewhere. 10 days for him to showcase himself, and another preseason game.

GB has to cut five more players on Tuesday. Caleb Jones won't be one of them, so we fans will see him against KC on the 25th. Time to judge in earnest then.

Edit: I failed to see the play you referenced. Now that OL can't go low on DBs and LBs for that matter outside, there have been more linemen missing. Where did that play occur? Was Jones prohibited from going low? Not sure it makes a difference, or ought to, but I'm just curious, so maybe it makes a difference to me. LOL. Tired. Translate my babble, please.

3 points
3
0
dobber's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:53 am

"The issue for me is deciding whether GB can slide him through waivers and onto the PS."

This might be a situation where the Packers take long looks at Tom and Van Lanen next week, limit C Jones' snaps to hide him, and then give him a sweeter deal to stick on the PS. A waiver claim requires a team to put the player on the 53, so limiting his snaps might deter other teams from making that leap.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:16 pm

I wouldn’t waste more time on Tom. His issue is being physically overwhelmed by back ups. That’s not going to change this year.

Van Lanen doesn’t seem any less convincing at G than Hanson. I thought he actually was pretty good last night. The Jones and CVL left side definitely the better side in the second half. Hanson did not impress me at C. I’m starting to wonder if we really wasted Tom’s preseason. He’s much more credible physically as a C at this point.

I’m really questioning some of the handling of the O line. I think we are messing with Newman too and I think that will come back to bite us. If there was a player on that line that would have benefited from not being moved it was Newman.

4 points
4
0
PatrickGB's picture

August 21, 2022 at 07:53 am

I agree. I sure hope that all the shuffling around of these players is for evaluation only. It’s nice to have flexibility but some players do not fit well in their new positions. I am underwhelmed by Hanson at guard. Tom needs work in the weight room. Jones needs to work on his flexibility and Newman needs to stay where he was. Ryhan looks lost. CVL remains an unknown.

2 points
2
0
LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:10 pm

I wonder about Heflin and Slayton making it to the PS too. There's certainly more of a shortage D linemen that can play than WRs and backup DTs see snaps pretty much every week.

1 points
1
0
LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:11 pm

Double. Think that was on my WiFi

0 points
0
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:41 pm

Maybe I'm nitpicking, but there were two plays, both run blocking assignments. With 5:06 on clock in 3rd, 1st and 10. CJ seemed lost on who to block, the backside DL or the LB/S in front of him. That indecision won't work when live bullets are flying.

The other play was in the 4th at 12:06 on 2nd and 11. He was double teaming and went off the block to try and catch Zach Baun but was too slow and agile to get him. Zach made the tackle behind the LOS.

I will say he looked very good pass blocking thou and had some good run blocks. That saId, he's playing in the 2nd half when you have DL and LB's who are not high-level, starter type players that you would see during real games. He's also playing against no stunting and vanilla defense. I question his athleticism and strength for his size. He's a promising prospect, but I'm still out on a large limb with him. I would see him being cut and keeping on the PS. IMO, there is no way he makes this team.

0 points
0
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:51 pm

Fair enough. He is playing against lesser players. Now it’s time to let him play against better ones. However, neither half saw starters, so Tom & Hanson weren’t playing against starters either. Neither faced any scheming or blitzing, despite there being big gaps for blitzers.

I don’t see Jones having a strength issue at all. In fact he’s been pancaking. I’m not sure about for his size. Not a lot of comparatives.

We might find he can’t hold up if tried, but that neither Newman nor Tom have either. We won’t know till they stop hoping that that is going to change from week to week. It should be Jones time at RT absent Jenkins. No more moving Newman. Hanson can concentrate on C with the twos. Both would benefit from doing so.

1 points
1
0
murf7777's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:10 pm

TGR, I re-watched both CJ and Tom at tackle for last night game. It showed me Tom is better at this point. I didn't go back and watch the SF game thou. I believe if you don't watch each play we only see and hear about a few plays. Consistency is more important and the only way you see that is if you concentrate on each player, one play at a time.

0 points
1
1
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2022 at 08:39 pm

Ross Uglem and Ben Fennell have some video clips of Tom run blocking on their twitter feeds. Both guys showed Tom executing excellent, big time run blocks that helped spring the RB, I think Goodson. It seemed to me that Tom was back deep in the backfield on some pass pro, but he was between the rusher and the QB. Tom moves well, and is good at cutting off the edges on speed rushers.

Here is the Ben Fennell clip. Yes, it also shows Tyler Davis missing a block on #96 and #96 ends up making the tackle, but at least it was well downfield due to the good blocking of other Packers.

https://twitter.com/BenFennell_NFL/status/1561013794968666116

0 points
0
0
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:53 am

I think if he lost a little more weight and had a full off season to work out and get comfortable at the weight he would show better. Work on his quickness and coordination. It can be done!

0 points
0
0
jhtobias's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:51 am

Look no matter what jordan love does or doesn't do he will never get a fair shake in green bay. It is the Favre rodgers effect .

Best thing for Jordan is to play elsewhere for the young man's own sake. Packer fans are extremely spoiled and Jordan could start on 10 different teams and give them a chance.

I hope for his sake he is traded option not picked up so he can have career . He made throws last night that very can make not his fault his wr can't catch.

Lay off Jordan. Hold your head up high Jordan forget what these arm chair gms say. Your an bfl qb

0 points
3
3
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:56 am

jht,
I have been a big fan of Love before he was even drafted by the GBP's. Just like when we had Favre there were fans who did not like Rodgers because Favre was the man. When Rodgers likely leaves in a year or two Packer fans (even the ones who do not want him right now) are likely going to be on the bandwagon welcoming him. The Packers need a good QB to replace Rodgers and it is looking more and more like Love has that potential to be a good QB. Keep him and keep developing him. He is only 23-years old and going to keep getting better and better. You can see the talent emerging....

1 points
2
1
dobber's picture

August 20, 2022 at 11:55 am

Glad they got some flash plays out of Abernathy and Davis, because if Scott is out for any length of time, there's no depth at the S position...and arguably very thin depth WITH Scott. Will be interesting to see if the Packers go safety shopping this week. It could be they wait until after the KC game to see if they can trade for an odd-man-out somewhere.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:25 pm

We have a big problem at RT (hopefully temporary). We may have a big one at S, pending injury news. We do have one at TE. Davis has crossed the Styx.

I only see one trade piece and that’s Lowry. We are very tight on cap without some benefit there. Maybe Gute can pull a rabbit out of the hat, but TE hasn’t been his best area. The best performance was probably from the guy we signed last week.

I wonder if Nixon can move back to S. If he can that might be our best bet. I think some have seen him as better suited there in the past. SJC has looked perfectly capable of handling the CB role. Ento would be a logical additional CB. Thomas just seems incredibly unlucky in his match ups, to the point where I think it more likely that he flatters to deceive rather than just being unfortunate.

0 points
0
0
stockholder's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:40 pm

RT - That will end when Jenkins comes back. Bet Gutey picks up a vet.
Unless you bring in a TE with a big salary. Lowry is on this team. His stats from last year iced it.
Safeties are in demand. More snaps coming Abernathy.

0 points
1
1
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 03:01 pm

Lowry is better than Heflin. But he’s also the only real opportunity to both regain some cap and at a position where there is extra depth. I agree with you that a decent TE will cost. Hence the dilemma. We don’t get better cutting Lowry but we might if the return in a trade is a bigger upgrade a TE.

As far as Jenkins goes, yes. Once he is back. I’m not sure yet that that will be week one. Even if he is back then, we need a back up and I’m not buying Tom or Newman/Hanson against starters and a DC looking to exploit weak spots.

2 points
2
0
LLCHESTY's picture

August 20, 2022 at 02:17 pm

Lowry for Akwuegbunum? Hackett might be interested.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 03:04 pm

After last night maybe. Davis has been that bad . Before that I would have said no way. We can’t get through a whole season with Lewis as the only in line guy. Then again I’m not sure I’d count this guy as much of one. Bad choices.

0 points
0
0
Tedlyflyfisher's picture

August 20, 2022 at 12:46 pm

1. I’m really impressed by this defense. I know you shouldn’t read too much into preseason games (especially when you’re playing a lot of guys who aren’t starters!), but at the least we will have some quality depth.
2. Got to give credit to Gutey here. Not only am I impressed by most of the draft picks, but getting guys like Kiondre Thomas and Micah Abernathy, both of whom I think could be very valuable this season. (Factor in Gutey picking up Rasul Douglas and De’Vondre Campbell last year and I’d say Gutey is on a heck of a roll!)
3. We haven’t heard much about the health of Kylin Hill and I’d like to see him back. However, I am really not sold on Patrick Taylor and find Goodson more intriguing. Having said that, I realize the #3 rb needs to be able to protect #12 and also contribute to wefense. Taylor did make an excellent ST tackle yesterday. I hate to say it, but I’m just not sold at all on Amari. I don’t trust him as a returner or as a receiver.
4. Our DL is stacked and some of the guys who get cut will definitely get signed elsewhere.
5. I’m concerned that special teams is still not looking very good. I hope they devote plenty of time in practice to cleaning this up!

4 points
4
0
Galacticat's picture

August 20, 2022 at 03:02 pm

Yes it was against mostly backups but Caleb Jones looked like a man amongst boys out there. It is fascinating to me that the Packers played him at LT and not RT. At LT he can’t just move “well for his size”. He’s got to move well PERIOD. The fact that they’re looking at him at LT is pretty amazing. Just in what we’ve seen, how could you cut that kind of developmental prospect?? Yosh 2.0

2 points
2
0
muskiesting's picture

August 20, 2022 at 03:27 pm

McDuffie is making a run at being the #3 ILB. Then, Barnes gets on the field and just blows up a couple of plays. I wonder if any of those inside guys could contain the end and/or rush the passer

0 points
0
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2022 at 04:04 pm

I’d say he’s won that race. He was on a different level to anyone last night and that was with Barnes actually having a really good game.

0 points
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0
veteranviewer's picture

August 20, 2022 at 09:40 pm

What does % SF mean in your stat columns please?

0 points
0
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 21, 2022 at 02:11 am

Sorry, I got tired. It means the percentage of snaps that player played against San Francisco in game one. So, the table is Player, number of snaps vs. New Orleans, % of snaps vs. New Orleans, then percentage of snaps in game one against San Fran, and then STs/% is number of ST snaps and percentage of possible special teams snaps.

0 points
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Turophile's picture

August 21, 2022 at 04:55 am

It's always fun to try and guess WHY the snap counts are what they are for each player. As always, thanks to TGR for putting the work in.

For example Runyan and Myers only had 17 snaps each, but I think that was just to give them a bit of a run out. The Packers know what they have in these two players and they know both are probably starters on regular season game-days - no need to increase the chances of injury with more snaps.

On the other hand, I view the high number of snaps taken by Hanson and Van Lanen as indicating they are both on the cusp of being cut or put on PS, or even kept on the 53. They are getting a long look so the coaches can decide which of the three options they will choose. Tom, Nijman and Rhyan seem to be the primary backups on a fully fit o line, taking up spots 6,7,8. So, Hanson or Van Lanen will only make the 53 squad if the Packers keep nine O linemen.

A final comment on two things coldworld said. The "stop the Tom-foolery" comment doesn't make sense to me. Sure he's light in the pants for an OT, but he has enough technique and very nice feet to be at the least a quality backup from next year. Being able to play tackle and center is also a bonus (don't think he'll ever be a guard).

Maybe Rhyan should have had more snaps being a rookie 3rd round pick (he only had 27 vs NO and 34 against SF), but on the other hand he hasn't looked like a possible rookie starter at guard and he is sure to be kept on the 53, so he'll get more time in the future.

RB Goodson has had a good look with lots of snaps, but I'd say that is because he is probably RB3 over Taylor and Williams, at least until Kylin Hill returns, so the Packers are making sure he is good enough to make the roster (which he probably is).

So, you can see that I've given several different reasons for the number of snaps allocated to each player, it's all really subjective when you try and determine why things are as they are.

The comment by coldworld about Tom "Stop this Tom-foolery" surprised me. He is the 7th best lineman imo (I have him as a backup currently ranked below Nijman and above Rhyan) and a pretty surefire keeper.

Also, regarding the coldworld comment later about being surprised by Barnes. While he has holes in his game, I didn't see anyone better as a no.3 before the season started, though McDuffie has been surprisingly good this year and Campbell/Walker/Barnes/McDuffie look like the ILB keepers. Guys like Wilborn and Summers are on the outside looking in.

I would like to see more ST snaps allocated to both Barnes and McDuffie, to add to their value if they are kept. They each played only 2 snaps on ST. Maybe they just aren't that good on ST, I don't know the answer there.

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

August 21, 2022 at 04:48 pm

Both Barnes and McDuffie are good on STs. I think that part of the reason for their low ST snaps could be the fact they were focuses of attention on D: this was a big game for both and both and both played a lot of snaps. I think McDuffie will be number 3 at this point. He’s had a tremendous camp and just fits the type. Barnes probably cemented the 4th spot on Friday.

Conversely it’s possible that Ento was held back till later to see him on STs ( he was the highest graded Packer by PFF). That’s not uncommon in games like these and makes it harder to judge STs because many depth players post cut downs are not actually playing much or at all.

To be clear, I’m not saying, and have not said, that Tom is a bust (far too early for that and it is for Rhyan). I am saying that at this point he’s not ready at T and I have pointed out the reason which is not for a reason that PFF, will pick up on.

Against SF, I though Rhyan looked better than billed. He was not as good last night. But that’s common for rookies. Give it time. It looks like some technique snd recognition issues to me on Rhyan’s part and power on Tom’s. Rhyan’s are just more basic, more so than Newman’s last year, which only showed up against stunts in real games.

0 points
0
0