Packers Snap Counts V. The Chiefs: Week 13

The Packers pull off the upset against the Chiefs to notch another quality win.

 

The Packers elevated FB Henry Pearson and RB James Robinson to replace Deguara and Aaron Jones, and activated Darnell Savage off of Injured reserve.  The inactive players were Alexander (shoulder), Deguara (hip), Aaron Jones (knee) and Calel Jones, Samori Toure, and Brenton Cox were healthy scratches.  Rudy Ford, Devondre Campbell, Dontayvion Wicks, Jayden Reed, and CB Robert Rochell were all cleared to play.  Sean Clifford and Klu Kelly were active but did not play.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Myers 64 100 5-23%
Tom 64 100 5-23%
Jenkins 64 100  
Runyan 57 89 5-23%
Walker 56 88 5-23%
Nijman 8 12 5-23%
Rhyan 7 11  
Newman 1 2  

 

The Chiefs have had some trouble versus the run and the Packers offensive line has had some problems run blocking this season, but in this matchup the Packers offensive line won its match ups.  Running backs averaged 4.95 yards per carry for the game, many coming right up the gut.  Adding in 2 scrambles by Love and 2 reverses by Watson pushed the totals to 129 yards on 25 carries, good for 5.16 yards per carry.  There were only a few negative runs - the Chiefs registered 4 tackles for loss - and the run success rate was good.  The Packers used 21 personnel quite a bit and the TEs actually were helpful in the run game.  

The pass protection was quite good.  The Chiefs had 4 QB hits and 2 sacks.  Due to the general efficiency of both the running and passing game, the Packers often had favorable down and distance situations.  The Chiefs' Defensive Coordinator, Steve Spagnuolo, did dial up some creative blitzes that left the blitzer unblocked but Jordan Love usually got the ball out quickly or threw it away.  The Chiefs don't really have a high-end Edge player, relying on pressure packages and Chris Jones inside.  Jones, matched up primarily against the interior linemen, had a quiet game by his standards.  Jones had 2 QB hits and a couple more pressures but no tackles.  Jones destroyed Sean Rhyan when Rhyan came in for a series, but Jordan Love escaped left and even picked up 8 yards and a first down on the play.          

 

Player Snaps % STs
Dillon 40 62  
Taylor 20 31 7-32%
Robinson 4 6  

 

Dillon gained 71 yards on 18 carries (4.1-yard average) with a long of 10.  A lot of those yards were up the middle.  Dillon ran hard.  He caught his only target for 14 yards on 18 routes run.  Dillon was more effective running up the middle than wide, but some runs have to be designed to go outside.   He did make a nice move on his pass reception to gain those 14 yards.  Taylor gained 29 yards on 2 carries with a long of 24.  I must note that on his long run Taylor seemed to gain as few yards as were humanly possible given the space he had in which to maneuver.  Taylor ran 14 routes but had no receptions on one target.  James Robinson gained 2 yards on his only carry, which was an odd looking play.  He lost 2 yards on his only reception.  

 

Player Snaps % STs
Kraft 61 95 12-55%
Sims 20 31 5-23%
Pearson 9 14 12-55%

 

The Packers played 1.41 TEs per play on average against the Chiefs, a higher number than usual.  Initially, it appeared that Kraft was going to assume the role Musgrave enjoyed, as the Packers dumped some passes out to him in space and let him rumble downfield.  Actually, Kraft looked pretty spry with his yards after catch, if not quite the equal of Musgrave.  Kraft gained 37 yards on 6 targets and 3 receptions with a long of 19 yards.  He played nearly every snaps and ran 30 routes.  He also threw some useful run blocks, mostly in space or as a crackback.  A Edge player did put Kraft on roller skates.  Kraft caught 3 passes on 3 targets for 37 yards in the first half, but was shut out in the 2nd half, failing to catch any of his 3 second- half targets.  Sims caught his only target for one yard, but it was a touchdown on a well-designed play during which Royce Newman reported in as an eligible receiver that left Sims wide open.  Sims ran 7 routes.  Pearson had no statistics.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Love 64 100  
Clifford DNP    

 

Jordan Love had another very good day, looking both efficient while throwing a couple of big-time throws with no turnover-worthy episodes.  He completed 25 of 36 attempts (69.44%) for 267 yards (7.42-yards per attempt), with 3 touchdowns and no interceptions.  He had a 118.6 passer rating.  Love gained 10 yards on 2 scrambles.  Love threw some beautiful passes, including several to Christian Watson, both for touchdowns and to move the chains.  Kudos to LaFleur for going for it on 4th and one at the KC 44-yard line up 14 to 12, and Love delivered with a 33-yard bomb to Romeo Doubs with 3 defenders around him.  I admit that I held my breath when I saw Love loft that pass off his back foot down the middle, but it fell in Doubs' breadbasket at the 10-yard line.  2 plays later Love threw a 12-yard strike to Watson for a touchdown to push the score to 21-12.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Doubs 52 81  
Watson 47 73  
Reed 30 47  
Wicks 25 39  
Heath 11 17 11-50%

  

This is what an offense looks like with a functioning run game and a #1 wide receiver on the field.  Christian Watson caught 7 of 9 targets for 71 yards on 29 routes run (2.45 yards/route) with 2 touchdowns.  He caught contested passes, he went up for his touchdown pass, and he made some shorter third-down catches to move the chains, some of which were nice catches.  Watson has shown that he can be a big-play receiver, but if he can become a volume receiver who also moves the chains, that would be big.  Watson grabbed his hamstring without having been hit and left the game.  He was seen on the sideline after the game walking with a fairly normal gait.  Fingers crossed. 

Doubs caught all 4 of his targets for 72 yards (18 yards/target), with a long of 33.  Doubs ran 32 routes (2.25 yards/route).  He found some soft spots against zone coverage for huge plays of 33 and 27 yards.  Reed caught 4 of his 5 targets for 16 yards on 20 routes run.  Reed only plays when the Packers use 11 personnel.  Since the Packers ran a lot of 21 personnel, Reed played just 30 snaps (47%).  He did have a false start penalty.  Wicks caught 3 of his 4 targets for 43 yards on 16 routes run (2.69 yards/route) with a long of 27 yards.  Wicks produces when he is on the field.  Heath caught 1 of his 2 targets for 15 yards on 6 routes run (2.5 yards per route).  He did have a drop. 

The Packers scored 29 points on 7 possessions, punting twice.   

 

Player Snaps % STs
Clark 54 81  
Slaton 36 54 8-36%
Wyatt 31 46 3-14%
Brooks 24 36 4-18%
Wooden 5 7 3-14%

 

The Packers elected to play 2.24 true defensive linemen per play.  Clark had 5 tackles (2 solo) including a tackle for loss with 2 QB hits and a half sack.  He won his fair share of reps against a pretty good RG in Trey Smith.  Slaton had 3 assisted tackles and a pass defensed.  He did not win his fair share of reps against Creed Humphrey and Joe Thuney.  Wyatt had 1 assisted tackle which was a QB hit and a half sack.  It looked to me like he had a long day against the run.  The Chiefs gained 148 yards on 25 carries for a 5.92-yard average.  RB Isiah Pacheco gained 110 on 18 carries, a 6.11-yard average.  Pacheco gained a lot of yards after contact.  If there were a statistic for yards after contact by 3 or more defenders, Pacheco would have been listed high in such a category.  

 

Player Snaps % STs
Walker 67 100 3-14%
Campbell 55 82 3-14%
Smith 42 63  
Gary 40 60  
Enagbare 27 40 6-27%
Van Ness 25 37 4-18%
McDuffie     14-64%
Wilson     14-64%
Welch     14-64%

Walker led the Packers with 13 tackles, though just 4 were solo.  Campbell had just 4 tackles with just one solo tackle.  The Chiefs were pretty successful at getting a lineman out to put a hat on the linebackers.  McDuffie went from starting to getting no defensive snaps (something that likely will sadden Mike Wahle, who likes his physicality).  Gary had 4 assisted tackles including a QB hit for which he was credited with a half sack.  Enagbare had 3 tackles (1 solo).  Van Ness had 2 solo tackles, 2 QB hits hits, a tackle for loss and was credited with a sack.  Smith had 2 tackles (1 solo), a QB hit for which he was credited with a half sack.  The Packers sacked Mahomes 3 times, two of which I would deem coverage sacks.   There was not a lot of consistent pressure up the middle from the linemen but the Packers still managed to hit Mahomes 7 times, a normal amount for a game.  

 

Player Snaps % STs
Owens 67 100 11-50%
Valentine 67 100 3-14%
Ballentine 67 100  
Savage 61 91  
Nixon 56 84 9-41%
Ford 7 10 9-41%
Johnson 6 9 6-27%
Rochell     14-64%
Anderson     12-55%

 

Ballentine had 10 tackles (5 solo).  Owens had 5 solo tackles.  His hit though flagged was not a late hit on Mahomes.  His push of Kelce on the last play of the game was not flagged, but it was ill-advised.  Referees are reluctant to throw the flag on hail mary attempts on the last play of the game, but a hard shoulder bump is easier to ignore than a two-handed push.  Nixon had 5 tackles (2 solo) and a difficult interception that was hugely important late in the game.  Nixon also blocked to the whistle against Pecheco, drawing a personal foul and a disqualification of Pecheco.  That was important because the Chiefs' #2 running back, Jerrick McKinnon, was out for the game.  Savage had 4 solo tackles and a pass defensed.  Valentine had 2 assisted tackles and 1 pass defensed, though it may have been the blatant pass interference he committed against Valdes-Scantling that was not called.  He also allowed extra yards to a receiver due to using an arm tackle instead of good form.  Anthony Johnson had an assisted tackle.  Rudy Ford only played 7 snaps.  He was a limited participant in all three practices and was listed as questionable with a biceps injury.  He did play a lot of special teams snaps.   

The defensive backs held up well considering Douglas is gone and Alexander was out due to injury.  Mahomes and Kelce are good, but the rest of the receiving corps is pretty dismal.  Then again, Valentine, Ballentine, Owens, Johnson, and Savage have held up fairly well all season.  The Chiefs had 8 possessions (7 if you discount the kneel down at the end of the first half), and they only punted once, with one interception and they turned it over on downs to end the game.  

 

SPECIAL TEAMS:

Whelan put two punts inside the 20, including one that was downed inside the 5.  He averaged 38 yards gross and net.  Carlson made both of his field goal attempts with a long of 48 and all three of his extra point attempts.  McDuffie and Welch each had a special teams tackle.  Welch's extinguished a 31-yard kickoff return.

 

RB: 1.0

TE: 1.41

WR: 2.58

 

DL: 2.24

ILB: 1.82

OLB: 2.00

DBs: 4.94

 

Statistics courtesy of Nflgsis and routes run courtesy of Pro Football Focus.

Photo courtesy of Mark Hoffman, Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

 

 

 

 

6 points
 

Comments (68)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 04, 2023 at 06:18 am

Is 8 points still a one score game? If so, GB is now 4-4 in one score games this season. That is surprising to me. It is a credit to Love's composure, I suppose.

5 points
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Cheezehead72's picture

December 04, 2023 at 06:35 am

Eight points is not a one score game. It is a one possession game. A score of one to six is a one score game. Now seven and eight point games are one possession games. That is my definition.

2 points
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dobber's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:09 am

I'll buy that.

1 points
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:05 am

It makes sense. Some site called fourvertsfootball defined a one possession game as 8 points or less. It was written by Nathan D, so perhaps not exactly authoritative.

Buffalo Rumblings (an SB Nation site) defined a one score game as 7 points or less. I don't know how authoritative that is, either. I suppose the extra point can be considered to be so likely to be made (I think it has something like a 93% success, whereas the announcers asserted that the 2-point conversion rate in the NFL is 55%.

If 8 points is not a one score win, then GB is still 3-4 in one score games. which is much better than I anticipated they would be. Which was my point. Now, if you're Brian Knowles of Football Outsiders, you prefer to use a win probability model to arrive at "coin flip" outcomes. I don't care enough to track down how FO defined one score games.

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2022/9/29/23377661/buffalo-bills-one-sc...

1 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:27 am

"I suppose the extra point can be considered to be so likely to be made (I think it has something like a 93% success, whereas the announcers asserted that the 2-point conversion rate in the NFL is 55%."

These numbers dictate that it should be standard to go for 2, only deviating from that under special situations.

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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:09 am

The opponent can’t win it with one score, only tie, so I’d say no. There have two be two scores by the Chiefs at that point to win or a full extra time to tie.

4 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:28 am

I'd rather not face KC in OT. Bit of a nail biter there ...

0 points
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Lphill's picture

December 04, 2023 at 06:35 am

Van Ness is productive with more snaps, he had a nice game.

9 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:30 am

Interesting that "he only has a bull rush," and it's his bull rush that's producing. I don't feel bad for poor little Mahomes getting picked on by LUKE NESS MONSTER, but I do think he should be adding to his repertoire ...

0 points
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fireball's picture

December 04, 2023 at 06:37 am

I did not think the Packers capable of beating Kansas City. I thought there was too much talk of the Packers possibly beating Kansas. Forget about the possibility of winning, I thought, and just concentrate on playing a solid game.

And then, amazingly, the Packers defeat Kansas. What? Huh? Really?

Jesus! I mean sometime during the first few weeks of the season, I thought, and said, if the Packers ever start to jell ( and that was still a big if at the time ), if they ever start to get it together, if Love, for example, really starts to see and feel the game whole, it could be the beginning of a group of disorganized and fucked up but excellent football players and coaches suddenly starting to become a team.

Maybe. I don't know. But it's a good day, anyway, a great day, waking up and realizing you just beat the fucking Kansas City Chiefs the night before

-1 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:17 am

I said going into this game that I don’t think the Chiefs this year, or at least now, are the Chiefs people think they are. It showed. Despite Mahomes. We did less than their recent opponents on the ground, but enough to sustain possession and to allow us to convert.

Where we had to win was by putting up points. That wasn’t obvious given how good their pass D had been. On the night Love and the young skill players outplayed their D. We won the drop battle, sack battle and completion percentage.

If there’s one thing I think we got lucky with, it may have been the absence of the LBs that Spagnuolo relies on to drive his D. That was not the aggressive D I expected.

3 points
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WestCoastPackerBacker's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:41 am

Mahomes is not having a Mahomes-like season. And really, he is suffering from what Rodgers experienced in Green Bay later in his career . . . a true lack of weapons. Kelce is the go-to guy and the rookie is looking promising, but otherwise, there's not a lot of flashy or even reliable talent at WR. We know about MVS's drops, and Kadarius Toney just has not been productive. They are supposed to have a really good defense though, which is the opposite of the earlier Mahomes' teams, which had top offenses and weaker defenses. And yes the injuries to the first and second string MLB had to have impacted this game. But thinking about how many starters GB has played without for much of the year, I'm not feeling bad about that.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 12:33 pm

Mahomes hasn’t been bad. His supporting cast outside of Kelce haven’t been good as you say. Rice has had a couple of good games, but a lot of drops earlier and runs a very limited route tree. MVS has seen a big drop in catch rate and yards and Skyy Moore awful like Toney. Add to that problems defending the run (and thus in time of possession) and he’s been swimming up hill.

I thought yesterday was a pretty good snapshot of their struggles this year outside of the sack differential and the unexpected success of our passing game. Love put up clearly the best passer rating against them this year.

2 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:34 am

KC at their worst met GB at their best.

I'll TAKE IT!

ESPN also registers GB with 7 passes defensed, and KC with ... less than that. (2? 4? I forget)

0 points
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GregC's picture

December 04, 2023 at 06:57 am

I thought the Packers' pass protection got worse as the game progressed, and on the other side, I thought the Packers' pass rush got worse too. I wonder if others felt that way. If it's true, there must be some statistics to show it. Credit to the team's skill position players on offense and their back-end players on defense for closing out the Chiefs under difficult conditions in the second half.

I have to agree that Patrick Taylor got about as few yards as possible on that long run. An RB who could make a move of any kind would've picked up more yardage. This game would've been a big opportunity for Emmanuel Wilson.

6 points
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:05 am

All 3 of Mahomes' sacks occurred during the first half.
Both of Love's sacks occurred during the 2nd half.

Check and check? At least so it appears per just one stat.

2 points
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GregC's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:28 am

Thanks, that's what I thought, and I think it was true of pressure in general. I know Love should not have taken that sack at the end of the final drive, but the pocket collapsed on him pretty quickly.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:24 am

Perhaps Love could have thrown that away, but I thought what he did was move the ball into the middle? Perhaps that’s more important to Carlson?

The Chiefs don’t have a great rush from the front and didn’t blitz nearly as much as I expected or as effectively. Missing their top ILBs may have been the reason. Unlike most it seems. I didn’t think our OL was particularly good. Love, for the most part, was very good at getting away or getting rid of the ball and finding guys open.

3 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:56 am

Throwing that ball away costs 40 seconds of clock time. Not worth it.

It's possible that all the motion prevented the blitz. Though it seemed that LaFleur reduced motion in the second half.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:38 am

It could be motion, it could be the deficit changing the equation, but it’s also possible it was the absence of their to 2 ILBs in that scheme. Whichever way, it was to our advantage

1 points
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stockholder's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:00 am

Myers handled Jones.
Still want him gone now?.
I say Gute extends him.

-1 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:40 am

You say a lot of things. Yes, I still want him challenged. For exactly the same reasons as before through this time here.

3 points
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dblbogey's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:40 am

A great win over a good team, back in the playoff hunt, and you are babbling about Myers? Yes, I want him gone. He's a below average center, just as Runyan is a below average guard.

-1 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

December 04, 2023 at 02:26 pm

Myers blew that second level open on the long run. I saw Creed Humphrey put on skates more than once yesterday.

0 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:40 am

Greg, that one sack JL could have escaped from. Add that to his other errors throughout the game and he played GREAT :)

The exciting thing here continues to be that he can play THAT well, and we can still see potential to improve?!? What's his ceiling?

0 points
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T7Steve's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:44 am

The sacks the Chiefs took were close to the goal line and made them have to kick field goals. That was the difference and won the game. I remember thinking "I'd trade TDs for FGs all night long."

6 points
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4thand10's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:33 pm

I blame sticky coverage from Ballentine and Valentine. I’m excited about those guys and dare I say that either one of them is or possibly could be better than Stokes. It’ almost seams like they’re playing better on the back end without their starters. I have no stats in front of me to back this up, but they seem to be like velcro on whomever they’re covering. Is it just me?

0 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:52 am

Let's not rip on our veterans when they're out due to injury. It's enough to have others stepping up. As more return, it creates nice "problems" for coaches to have to decide how to hand out snaps. Fortunately the level of competition appears to be dropping off with only the Viqueens remaining on the schedule as a good (?) team; however, after the KC game we have to expect even lesser teams will come gunning for GB.

As important as it's been to evaluate JL10, (note my use of the past tense) evaluating DBs is also important to be able to draft well.

0 points
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RCPackerFan's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:45 am

I felt like the 2nd half KC started blitzing more. I could be wrong, but it felt like they were dialing up a lot more pressures.

4 points
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dobber's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:10 am

It felt like they were hitting the inside gaps pretty hard, yes.

2 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:58 am

I don't know how much that difference is due to coach direction, vs just getting through more often. Would make for an interesting analysis.

JL is getting the ball out FAST! I don't know if his actual release has sped up? Between this and being elusive, it's helped the O line tremendously. Sometimes they give him ample time in the pocket, but often JL is just making plays regardless of pressure. I think we're watching him elevate the level of play from those around him, and more than just WRs, too!

0 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

December 04, 2023 at 01:07 pm

If you watch the replay it's almost like he thought of making a move but all it did was slow him down more. I'm guessing he got heckled a bit when they watched film today. In real time my 1st thought was I hope Gutey isn't afraid to use a day 2 pick on a RB. To me instincts are the most important asset to a RB but without a baseline of speed they don't mean much.

https://twitter.com/NFL/status/1731499907931099540?t=h6m_-s5BJ2tIyD8p5t-...

2 points
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:49 am

Thanks for finding a video clip. Still looks to me like not getting an inch more than was blocked, which is the knock on Patrick Taylor.

0 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:05 pm

LL,

you see what I mean Thai #27 & 28 don't offer enough of a contrast to complement each other well? Straight downhill. (Or at an angle in this case) With ##33 and 28 on the field together, good playcalling and some run blocking, they're hard to defend. That also makes the passing game more effective.

I hope we get to see that ...

0 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 11:37 am

Greg, I also saw what you did but I think that's at least partially due to KC adapting and adjusting.

If fatigue is a factor, I'd like to see more rotation.

0 points
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murf7777's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:04 am

Jordan Love is growing up right before our eyes! Could it be? Will this be our 3rd great QB? Who knows, but it’s fun to watch him play and see his calm demeanor and poise in the pocket. Thanks Gutey for having the balls to pull off the trade up to take Love in the draft.

7 points
7
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T7Steve's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:38 am

Thanks, TGR.

The Chiefs only had 3 more plays. The way they were running it, I thought they killed us in time of possession. Do you have those times? Actually, they might have killed themselves just running it instead of pushing it down the field more. Lucky for us. Guess it plays into LH's theory to let a team get 5 running instead of 7 passing.

The Packers were lucky with the calls this game. About time. They've had them go the other way enough this season.

Did the poor Chiefs have a player go down an average of every 3 plays? The network didn't have to take their normal breaks, just waited for a Chief to go down, until it started happening too much and they ran out of commercials.

1 points
1
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dobber's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:11 am

TOP was almost even...Packers I think were at 30:30

"Lucky for us. Guess it plays into LH's theory to let a team get 5 running instead of 7 passing."

It seemed like Kelce was running free every time KC needed a first down until the 4th quarter.

3 points
3
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:10 pm

Dobber,

I think JB let Kelce run free on purpose, just to keep things exciting. A master class on creating a nail biter ...

(I jest)

0 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:37 am

Each team had essentially 2 very long drives in the first half (plus a kneel by KC). That’s extraordinary. The difference in the game was the return each got from those really. The second half was more normal but balanced.

I thought the calls balanced out. MVS was not out of bounds. Mahomes was in bounds and Owens may have prevented him getting a first down by inches. I think they also left 10 seconds on the click that they shouldn’t have, but I won’t count that as I’m not certain. If either of the first two plays are called properly the PI is moot I suspect as the field position and clock is materially different.

No one calls that Hail Mary PI. There are a couple of reasons: the nature of the play, as Mahomes himself said (to his credit), and the fact that the ball was over Kelce anyway. He’s not reaching that regardless. The officials melted at the end of the game without doubt, but the commentary team outdid them.

2 points
2
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LLCHESTY's picture

December 04, 2023 at 01:11 pm

It almost seemed like after the bad call on Owens they tried to make up for it. Valentine definitely should have gotten a PI on MVS mugging. Let's just say they're not going to like their grades from the league office this week.

2 points
2
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:17 pm

CW,

the play clock was running while the game clock was not. Refs never corrected that. This was a different event from the 10 seconds you refer to, but not far removed from that part of the game. This worked against us.

I think that on balance, GB has still had more bad calls / non calls hurt them, neither do I think both these late non calls in our favor would have guaranteed KC the win. This one win may be as close as we get to evenning things out? Ironic that it brings us to 6-6.

GPG!

0 points
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WestCoastPackerBacker's picture

December 04, 2023 at 11:17 am

Well the Packers used up half of the first quarter on their first drive. It was a really impressive drive, with Dillon doing exactly what they need him to do, and Love hitting open guys. GB did it's fair share of run plays as well. But I was curious when the Chiefs were behind 21-12, I expected a QB like Mahomes to air it out, but they started the 4th quarter running the ball quite a bit.

1 points
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Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:46 am

I was puzzled by your statement “ I must note that on his long run Taylor seemed to gain as few yards as were humanly possible given the space he had in which to maneuver.” I have yet to rewatch, but that didn’t match my live take.

What I did see live was him seeming to be intent on not going out of bounds at the end to keep the clock running. Whether that was him or team instructions is impossible to know.

More generally, in that game what I saw was Dillon making yards despite the OL. The Chiefs are not good against the tun up the middle, but Dillon ran hard enough to force the D to keep defenders in the box. That deserves both personal praise and acknowledgment that it was key to the win.

The DL did little against their IOL, but that’s pretty good. The outside rush did enough, in the first half particularly. The Chiefs may have had issues at T, but Mahomes is mobile and they’d only given up 13 sacks prior to this game. Credit the outside rush in this one for ending drives.

The biggest help to the D was the early lead. That’s two games where we’ve essentially knocked a head coach off his game and away from our weakness. We were giving up 6 yards per carry. A slow start and deficit and this game would have been very different.

Kraft has quicker feet and better balance than Musgrave. It’s interesting to see, but not surprising, that he’s emerging in the role Musgrave held. How he and his role is developed going forward will be interesting. Personally, I think he and Musgrave look like they got different route types and trees, but both could be big offensive contributors if allowed. We still need a true blocking option going forward.

Overall, we are playing the type of game we were previously forced to play in second halves and we are doing it better on O and the D is spending much less time on the field and we are forcing teams to pass more. Love and the O has been able to get some rhythm and the DL some rest.

How much if this is Loves talent and how much LaFleur letting him play to his strengths not be a game manager early on will be interesting to see. One way or another, that O finally reminds me of what we thought LaFleur was bringing in 2020. Love reminds me more of Favre than Rodgers. It fits that O well.

4 points
5
1
dobber's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:22 am

"The biggest help to the D was the early lead."

Playing with a lead is huge for this team...I think the offense plays much looser and doesn't press as hard.

IN EDIT:
Packers record when they score first: 4-2
Packers record when leading after 1st Qtr: 4-1
Packers record when leading at half: 4-1

As maligned as the defense has been, and as much as they give up yards in the run game, they've kept this team in pretty much every game this season but one (or maybe two, depending on how you view the Vikings game). They've been far more aggressive the last couple weeks.

"How he and his role is developed going forward will be interesting. "

I read an analysis of the Musgrave and Kraft picks shortly after the draft and the guy summed it up pretty well by saying the Packers got Mike Geisicki and Pat Freiermuth clones. That would be a pretty good outcome.

"How much if this is Loves talent and how much LaFleur letting him play to his strengths not be a game manager early on will be interesting to see. "

We're seeing motion at the snap on many plays, now, and I think that's making Love's reads easier. They're also generating yards when they do go with jet/sweep action handoffs. They're forcing defenses to defend the width of the field, and we weren't seeing that for awhile.

4 points
4
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:55 am

I, too, will have to watch a replay of the play before I would feel comfortable brutally contradicting you!! [I watched the highlights but the play in question was not shown since there was no score associated with it. Maybe I will be able to watch it later.]

Taylor took a handoff up the middle (per ESPN and NFLgsis) 24 yards to the KC 32-yard line with 32 seconds left in the first half. KC had t3imeouts and GB had one remaining. KC took their first timeout at the end of the run. GB is looking at a 49-yard field goal, but it still has a first and ten along with a timeout. Reed then commits a false start, pushing GB back to the 37 (and a 54 yard FG - the score is 14-6 GB). Surprisingly, GB then goes INC short middle, INC short right and then completed pass short middle to RB James Robinson for minis 2 (an ugly looking play), pushing them back to the GB 39, and making the FG attempt 56 yards with 18 seconds left. KC took its 2nd timeout. GB elected to punt, and that was well done and downed at the KC 3-yard line with 9 seconds left. KC did a kneel down.

What I remember is Taylor veering to the right and eventually facing two defenders who were coming up in run support. I remember Taylor slowing down, allowing the defenders to both breakdown and close the distance to limit the gain. I remember Taylor making no effort to elude or break a tackle. The best I could say is he made sure he wasn't going to fumble. Of course, my memory could be garbage. I do remember thinking that this play is exhibit one as to why GB has been able to elevate Taylor, send him back down, release him and then re-sign him so they can promote him from the PS three more times without any other team sticking their nose into the situation.

1 points
2
1
Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 11:55 am

Your memory isn’t off, it looks to me like his intent is to be sure he doesn’t lose the ball and doesn’t go out of bounds. I read that as instructions and the play following as confirming that. Force the TO and wind down the clock as much as possible before.

It’s available here https://www.packers.com/video/game-highlights-packers-vs-chiefs-week-13-...

1 points
1
0
JerseyAl's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:20 pm

They 100% were looking to keep the clock running and not give the ball back to KC with time on the clock for them to do something. As you mention, the two plays in a row are clear indicators of that.

0 points
0
0
LLCHESTY's picture

December 04, 2023 at 01:20 pm

I read it as he was thinking about trying a little shake and bake but all it did was slow him down more!

If Jones is gone I hope Gutey either uses a day 2 pick on RB or tries the approach that netted them Jones and Williams on day 3. If Jones and Dillon are both gone grabbing two or three in the draft is almost a necessity.

1 points
1
0
PeteK's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:28 am

I definitely see Rogers, finesse throws and take some yds on a scramble, more than Favre, who used to bazooka those throws and run through people.

2 points
2
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:22 pm

CW,

dare we say it? Is our offense starting to gel? And if so, this is just THE BEGINNING! SO much room for improvement, still ...

0 points
0
0
tobinrote's picture

December 04, 2023 at 07:51 am

who would have thought that a team that for that losing streak was not even close to prepared and looked about as bad as it was possible to look, is starting jell, but I still found myself yelling at the tv when i saw yet again only two D linemen out there as the Chiefs were having an easy time of it running the ball. and TGR's numbers bear it out. as usual this is always an excellent column. thanks TGR

5 points
5
0
PeteK's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:29 am

For me it was the poor tackling, defenders tackling Pacheco's shoulder pads instead of going low and wrapping up.

2 points
2
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:25 pm

Both, yes.

Still lots to "clean up."

Which means: this team can be REALLY GOOD, once the glaring errors / weaknesses are fixed.

0 points
0
0
LLCHESTY's picture

December 04, 2023 at 01:24 pm

The Chiefs could have had prime Jim Brown in the backfield and Barry would still be more paranoid about Mahomes beating them. Teams stop the run with 2 DL all the time, it's all about fits and responsibilities. The Packers just aren't very good at it.

1 points
1
0
dobber's picture

December 04, 2023 at 08:31 am

In watching the game, it felt like Nijman and Rhyan played more snaps than that.

Packers will have some decisions to make in the secondary. Owens isn't great, but he plays hard...and got cheated on the PF call. Ford has been solid even if his PFF grade doesn't always support it. Johnson looks like he could have a future. Savage, of course, is much-maligned but had been steady when healthy playing under his fifth year option. Only Johnson has a contract for 2024. I think they'll try to keep Ford and draft at least one safety. They might keep Owens just for the gratuitous Simone Biles sideline hype.

"The inactive players were...and Calel Jones, ....."

Superman's cousin must've been off saving people from a building fire or something.

3 points
3
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:27 pm

I really hope Mt Caleb gets at least his first NFL snap in these next 5 games ...

0 points
0
0
NFLfan's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:01 am

According to Love he and his receivers have been practicing independently after scheduled practices. Love has explained to each receiver where he needs them
to be on a given play. This process has tightened up WR route running and as a consequence, there are less drops & more simpatico w/Love.

5 points
5
0
T7Steve's picture

December 04, 2023 at 09:56 am

Wonder if that's legal under the bargaining agreement? I know they can do that all they want during the off season.

1 points
1
0
PeteK's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:36 am

I believe that only applies to team/coaches mandatory practices. Don't go and snitch on them Steve. LOL

2 points
2
0
T7Steve's picture

December 04, 2023 at 11:23 am

"Out of sight out of mind." -Jim Harbaugh

1 points
1
0
Coldworld's picture

December 04, 2023 at 10:45 am

Players are free to do so on their own time as long as it’s completely their own initiative with no team encouragement or involvement.

2 points
2
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:32 pm

:)

0 points
0
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:31 pm

Thank you for saying this! I'm not going to ask for a source, because it LOOKS LIKE this is exactly what's been happening :)

"A champion is whoever pays the price no one else is willing to pay."

Peyton Manning put in copious time studying film.

Jerry Rice worked out like a madman.

Hopefully everybody on this roster takes this to heart. Do we have to wait until next season to see LVN add more than just a bull rush to his repertoire?

0 points
0
0
THESZOTMAN1's picture

December 04, 2023 at 02:55 pm

The 4th and 1 bomb to Doubs may have been the biggest play of the game. Kept successful drive going that led to game clincher. Great throw and catch.
The Szotman

4 points
4
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:34 pm

Luck? Skill?

In this case I don't even care. It WORKED!!

As a highlight, this one deserves to endure ...

0 points
0
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

December 05, 2023 at 01:07 am

PFF Grades (per Packerswire)

91.8 Love
88.9 Watson
85.3 Wicks
73.7 Myers
73.2 Dillon

62.6 to 73.1 - Everyone else not specified

62.5 Jenkins
61.4 Reed
60.9 Taylor
55.5 Heath
54.4 Runyan. One of his better days, still had the worst grade.

85.0 Savage
78.5 Enagbare
76.9 Nixon
65.2 Clark. Whopping 6 pressures. Run grade must've been bad.
64.9 Valentine

64.8 to 57.5 Everyone else not specified

57.4 Smith
56.2 Van Ness. Bad run grade
53.6 Ballentine
49.1 Campbell
35.0 Brooks Missed tackle, lowest run grade. He does have splash plays.

1 points
1
0
SicSemperTyrannis's picture

December 05, 2023 at 12:40 pm

Man I'd love to see detailed analysis of the O line, and especially comparing this game to the 4 game losing streak. There are so many moving pieces that it's hard for me to have much of an idea how the O line is contributing. Some here didn't see our O line do particularly well. I see JL10 getting the ball out quickly, and greatly improved elusiveness / avoiding the sack. A QB performing well under pressure is not the same thing as an O line improving.

JRJ (or anyone else) against Chris Jones is going to have a rough day ...

0 points
0
0