The Lass Word: Looks Like Rodgers is Part of a Rebuild After All

Packers are doing a subtle revamp of the roster.

Most of the time, football fans get depressed when they hear that their team is “rebuilding”.  That’s because “rebuilding” is commonly a code word for losing.  It usually means your team is getting rid of most of its established players, and starting over with a collection of young, unproven talent.  Talent that will, if you’re lucky, gel over time and learn to win, but which, in the short term, is going to lose big time. 

 

In the ideal scenario, the front office would make the rebuild so gradual, that it would have little, if any, impact on your won-loss record.  Vince Lombardi was a master of this.  During the Packer dynasty of the 1960’s, Lombardi engineered a seamless transition from players like Jim Taylor, Paul Hornung, Max McGee, Ron Kramer, Jim Ringo, Dave Hanner, Hank Gremminger and Jesse Whittenton, to a new iteration that included Elijah Pitts, Donny Anderson, Jim Grabowski, Marv Fleming, Ken Bowman, Lionel Aldridge, Herb Adderley and Bob Jeter.  The former group started on Lombardi’s first championship team in 1961.  The latter group started on his last one in 1967.   

 

The constant throughout the transition was the quarterback.  As long as Bart Starr was at the controls, the team remained in the title hunt every year, regardless of the supporting cast.   

 

I am certainly not saying that Brian Gutekunst is on a level with the great Lombardi, but I do sense an attempt at a similar approach in the modern day Packers.  The narrative for this team seems to be that they are standing pat, trying to “run it back” with basically the same players, as opposed to launching into rebuilding, and therefore losing, mode. 

 

But if you really look at it, the reality is Green Bay is, and has been, gradually rebuilding under the Gutekunst-LaFleur regime.  In LaFleur’s first year (2019), his starting line up included Davante Adams, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, Jimmy Graham, Corey Linsley, Billy Turner and Bryan Bulaga on offense.  The starting defense featured Blake Martinez, Zadarius Smith and Kevin King.  All are now either departed or remain unsigned and unlikely to come back.  That’s nine out of twenty-two preferred starters replaced in three seasons.  Ten, if you include Chandon Sullivan at slot corner.  Nearly fifty percent of the starters.   

 

It should be pointed out that one of these forced his way off the team.  That would be Adams.  The Packers actually offered him more money to return, but he chose to leave to play for the Raiders.  The others were allowed to walk away, as the team felt the need to find younger, cheaper replacements.  In other words, the need to rebuild. 

 

The reason you don’t see the word “rebuild” connected with the Packers is because, just as in the Lombardi days, the constant is the quarterback.  Green Bay has won thirteen games in each of the last three seasons, remaining competitive for championships while reshuffling a significant segment of their roster.  This is a big reason why the front office committed to an extension for their future Hall of Fame signal caller.  Aaron Rodgers has said he doesn’t want to be part of a rebuild, but he is actually smack dab in the middle of one.  It’s his job to make it seamless.  And he’s good enough to do it.  To some extent, he already has. 

 

Bulaga and Turner are being replaced by budding young players such as Yosh Nijman, Jon Runyan, Royce Newman and possibly Elgton Jenkins, depending on what position Jenkins plays.  Linsley has been replaced with Josh Myers, who started as a rookie last year.  Graham is long gone, as the Packers place their hope for the future at tight end on Robert Tonyan and Josiah Deguara.  Martinez’ spot has been filled with the elite play of De’Vondre Campbell.  King became expendable when young Rasul Douglas proved to be a diamond in the rough.  Jamal Williams has been reinvented with the drafting of AJ Dillon. 

 

At some point this offseason, the Packers will replace Adams and MVS.  I can’t tell you if they’ll do it by signing a veteran, or through the draft, or both, but I can assure you the new receivers will be cheaper and quite likely younger.   

 

Ask the average fan which NFL teams are in rebuild this offseason, and most will quickly respond by pointing to the Seahawks, or the Falcons, or the Texans.  Why?  Because they have traded their quarterbacks.  Yet when the Packers take the field for their 2022 season opener, they will have redone nearly half of their starters from three years past.  You may not have noticed because the transitions have not plunged the team into a spiral. 

 

Of course, at some point, Green Bay will have to pull the plug on Rodgers. That will be the major challenge of the rebuild.  It’s really difficult to keep right on winning while changing signal callers.  Even the Brett Favre to Rodgers transition began with a 6-10 season, though it should be noted that losing season was largely the fault of the defense, not the quarterback. The hope would be that Jordan Love, after watching and learning for three or more seasons, will be ready, and the defense will have improved enough to carry the team until he is.  

 

If the Packers can pull off that transition, it would be an accomplishment even Lombardi would be proud of. 

-----------------------------------

Ken Lass is a former Green Bay television sports anchor and 43 year media veteran, a lifelong Packers fan, and a shareholder.

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12 points

Comments (147)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
TacoTuesday's picture

March 25, 2022 at 06:47 am

I say take one of our first-round picks this year (trade it for a future first-round pick ) and kick it down the road for a year or two. That way we have the ammo to pull the trigger on drafting a top-tier QB if AR leaves/retires and Love is not the answer.

-11 points
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PearlyBakerBest's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:44 am

Love is already not the answer

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Johnblood27's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:31 am

It is soooo easy to predict that someone will not live up to back to back HoF QB play.

That is the easy way out of a meaningful evaluation of a player who has had little chance to develop along traditional lines due to a global pandemic and backing up said future HoF QB, limiting his reps.

Jordan Love has every bit as much promise as AR had coming out of college and after his first couple seasons as a pro and more than Favre had.

Please, just stop being such a douche and have some enthusiasm for the Packers next potential HoF QB until he actually gives you some reasons NOT to root for him.

11 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:30 am

Amen, Johnblood. So many "fans" have been just itching for Love to fail just so they can say they were right about him. Its disgusting, to be honest, but hardly surprising. Im old enough to remember the exact same vitriol towards Rodgers and Thompson. They hated Thompson for not drafting a receiver for Favre. Even made "fire Ted Thompson" websites and booed Rodgers at the Family Night scrimmage multiple years when he didnt look. great. They demanded Thompson trade Rodgers for Randy Moss in 2007 because mUh ReCeIvErS. But then this crazy thing happened. Packers stuck with Rodgers and he developed into a hall of famer. Now those same fans are clutching onto Rodgers for dear life and are now sending their vitriol towards Love and Gutekunst. Grown ass men and women hating a good young kid just cuz they didnt get the toy they wanted with their happy meal. Its embarrassing.

6 points
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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:23 pm

NECESSARY. BRAVO!!!

5 points
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Duneslick's picture

March 25, 2022 at 02:02 pm

None of the scouts or football people thought Love was as good of a prospect as rodgers coming out of college. Not even close

0 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:10 pm

That doesnt change the fact that Rodgers was hot garbage his first 2 seasons. There were scouts who thought guys like Ryan Leaf and Jamarcus Russell were franchise qbs. Just goes to show that what people think about a guy pre-draft means nothing. Its what they become that matters. Can we give Love a chance or are we letting no-name scouts for other teams run the Packers now?

2 points
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Johnblood27's picture

March 25, 2022 at 06:13 pm

Rodgers went 24th. One team passed on him 2 times!

He was not the hot shit you imagine.

If the Pack didn't grab him at 24 how far would he have fallen? You cannot answer that one.

Love was a legit 1st round talent in a QB heavy draft in an era when QB has become EVERYTHING, not at all the same environment when AR was drafted.

Love had a 158.3 QB rating his Junior season, better than ANY college season Rodgers EVER had. Fact, live with it. his team and coach all changed his senior year and his stats took a fall. He was still pretty damn good in a shit show of a season.

Fact - he was worth a 1st and a 4th. Live with it.

3 points
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Rebecca's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:47 pm

Wow 😮! Nice TRIGGER PULL.

2 points
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PackEyedOptimist's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:13 am

Hah. Get ready for the downvotes. I completely agree with you and posted the same idea a few days ago.

-4 points
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Handsback's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:40 am

Well Taco I can’t say that’s a bad idea. It wouldn’t expect a one for more like a 1 and 2 for this year’s 1.

0 points
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davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:51 am

The 2022 draft is loaded with more talent than the 2023 draft would be (largely b/c so many players weren't in last year's draft due to COVID and not playing but are now available for the 2022 draft). If it's been reported that a 2022 2nd rounder is worth a 2023 1st rounder - as noted in Adams' trade reporting for example - it would make more sense to load up on 2022 draft capital and run with the BPA model.

For example, it would make more sense to 'trade down' (within the 2022 draft) one of the 2022 #1s than to trade it in a package for a lesser-valuable 2023 1st rounder. I'm not advocating that, but stating it would make more sense than transferring a 2022 draft pick for a 2023/2024 equivalent round pick.

3 points
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PearlyBakerBest's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:48 pm

Do you guys pay attention to the salary cap? Love has had two seasons of training camp and practices. The writing is on the dead money.

-1 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:37 pm

Wrong. He had no rookie minicamp. No rookie preseason. And only 2/3 of last year's preseason. Youre probly one of the same fans i mentioned in my earlier post who wanted to dump Rodgers cuz he wasnt great after 2 years. In fact, Rodgers was so bad after year 2, even he began to question if he could ever become a starter. In all likelihood, Love is probly further along than Rodgers was at this same point in his career. But yeah lets dump him without ever really giving him a fair chance. This is why gm's dont listen to fans.

3 points
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PearlyBakerBest's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:52 pm

I'm sure he wasn't sitting on the couch during his rookie year. If you watch the cap you can figure out what is going on. It's ok to not watch the cap. I don't know if Love can play or not. And for the record, I didn't dump on him or say he couldn't play or progress. But if he can, will it matter? What kind of team can they put around him if/when he does start. To me, based on looking at the cap alone, they already know he is not the answer.

-1 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:21 pm

If you were following the team at all you’d know that there was no off season and a severely truncated preseason and that the Packers decided to use Boyle as back up and to take the bulk of snaps and then also run the scout team during the first season. Lafleur admitted that Love threw more balls to receivers in mini camp last year than in his entire time with the Packers the year before.

2 points
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PearlyBakerBest's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:06 pm

Who cares? The point is they wouldn’t have blown up the cap for the next several years if they thought he was the guy. IMO. So I made a mistake about his rookie preseason. If Rodgers plays two more seasons and Love is going to be the next guy it means they picked up his 5th year option for $20 mil ish And he’ll be the starter in a season that they have 68(?) mil in dead money. Doesn’t make sense to me.

0 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:18 pm

I follow the cap closely but i dont think it has anything to do with where Love is in his development. These acts of desperation have everything to do with money. They have a ton of money tied up in the Titletown District and lost a ton of money in the 2020 covid year. Theyre afraid of losing money if Love has a rough first year starting and the team doesnt win. Keep in mind, Rodgers went 6-10 in his first year starting and that was his 4th year in the league. Also, i wouldnt rule out Murphy making an executive decision cuz he wants another ring on his way out the door. None of this has to do with Love or else they wouldve traded him already.

1 points
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Minniman's picture

March 25, 2022 at 02:21 pm

Intriguing idea, but I think at this stage that the picks will be needed for the reload - unless the draft falls horribly for the Packers and the value (or player) isn’t really there.

Either way, according to those pick value sites, a 1st round pick next year is approximately only worth a mid\high second round this year.

0 points
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oceanstrength's picture

March 25, 2022 at 06:55 am

Every year is a rebuilding year! So what?

7 points
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Minniman's picture

March 25, 2022 at 02:43 pm

… and re-scheming the coaching and playbook……. And adjusting the team composition to execute on it.

With back-to-back-to back post season “failures”, the approach - as it stood - was not right……… and it was rooted in an absence of positional depth (in part brought on by the number of top heavy contracts - itself a product of mediocre drafts).

As oceanstrenght said - it’s always a year to rebuild - just not a high profile year involving a new QB this year.

1 points
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NickPerry's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:00 am

Gute has done an excellent job anytime there's a perceived weakness on this Packers team. He seems to throw both FA and draft picks at the weakness, which IMO has been pretty damn successful. He did it on the O-Line, signing Billy Turner, veterans later in the summer in each of the last two years, but also drafting 3 O-Linemen in each of his last 2 drafts. He did it on the Edge with the Smiths and then Gary, and at Safety with Amos and adding Savage.

I know there's LOTS of Packers Fans, especially here at CHTV who didn't care to have Rodgers back at the price it took. I was one of them myself. Hell, I was in favor of trading Rodgers for ALL of those players and picks, AND trading Adams, especially after getting a 1st and 2nd. I mean COMMON MAN, having SIX picks in the first 59 selections THIS year while also KEEPING the defense together? I for one would have jumped at that every day of the week and TWICE more on Sunday.

BUT, that didn't happen and we now get to play will he or won't he retire for the next 2, 3 or 4 years. So now I'm waiting. I have faith in Gute, i really do. But I'm also waiting on the LINE OF PLAYERS who will take LESS to come to GB to play with Rodgers. 12 said it himself, GB isn't a vacation destination, they come here to play WITH #12.

Well 12, time is a ticking. FA has more less come and gone and we have Allan Lazard. There's quite a few busted and broken guys left, or a few slower guys like Jarvis Landry, but we already have Cobb and Amari Rodgers to play the slot. Maybe I'm WAY off but I'm starting to wonder if anybody really wants to play with you. Hell, nobody is taking less OR even more to come to GB to play with 12. I haven't even heard a whisper of someone wishing to come here but I could be wrong.

Lets go 12...You got YOUR money. Now get those recruiting skills going you told us all about and help Gute. Just like you WANTED!

18 points
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Dragon5's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:48 am

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-which-general-managers-make-the-best-nfl-...

Interesting article regarding Gute's (misusage?) of draft capital; data don't lie. I'd argue that his achilles is overpaying for the players he wants sans trades; perhaps the most concerning aspect is what the author deems a value perception flaw with Gute's reluctance to trade back.

15. Brian Gutenkunst – Green Bay Packers

Best Trade Down: Marcus Davenport @ pick 14 (gained 1176 points, 37th overall)
Worst Trade Up: Darnell Savage @ pick 21 (lost 1001 points, 52nd overall)

Explanation: Trading away from Davenport is the only trade down Gutenkunst has executed in his time as GM, and accompanying that trade, he did perform some book balancing trade-ups. He has only performed six trades in his time as GM, but his only saving grace is low volume. His trade-ups, aside from Savage, individually didn't lose much more than Day 3 pick value. Trading, in general, does not appear to be a significant part of Gutenkust’s strategy, and he only seems to use it to move up.

1 points
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Handsback's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:46 am

Dragon, Savage to date has been a disappointment but doesn’t mean he’s a bust. I think his level of play has a lot more climbing to do and hope we will see it this year. I really liked him as a rookie, but he needs to read the field much better.

4 points
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Dragon5's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:15 am

Good odds Savage is injury prone in his soon to be personal 7 year beginning July 30th.
Reed, Smith, Douglas, King and to a lesser extent, Savage, headline injury risk for '22.
DL & Secondary depth a BIG concern from my perch; we'll soon see if Sullivan bolts to MIN.

-9 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:34 am

He hasnt even been a disappointment. He played like a pro bowler in 2020 but then took a step back last year playing in a new defense. It happens. Hes still far better than the average replacement out there and he still has a ton of upside to get better.

6 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:22 pm

Collins was no good by consensus until his 4th year, and for eerily similar reasons. Most safeties take time. Savage is still a potentially great pick. Here’s hoping,

3 points
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LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:38 am

Savage was not a savage on the field last season. He was not a liability at S, but seemed more timid in his tackling and apparently he played through several nagging injuries last year.

I know Barry looked at him for the Star/slot position but never moved him...probably needing him more at S as they were not very deep there.

I am expecting the Savage we saw in 2020 to take the field in 2022.

There will be some good S prospects in the second round and would not rule out drafting one in the first...because after Amos and Savage, the depth is unimpressive...scary thin, really.

Of the top 12 DBs listed by draft buzz, 5 are safeties and a few them have taken meaningful snaps at CB and slot defender and also played STs.

3 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:44 pm

With this likely being Amos' last season in Green Bay, dont be surprised if Packers draft somebody like Dax Hill in the 1st round. They love the 3 safety formations and getting Amos' replacement on the roster now makes a ton of sense.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:32 pm

I’m starting to come around to that, reluctantly. If we do, that likely means no early DL. I think we have to find an OLB. I think we have to draft WR if there is one with a first round grade too, or trade back and try to get an extra bite of the cherry at WR.

2 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:12 pm

With Ojabo tearing his achilles, Packers might be able to steal him for a much cheaper price than before the injury. If he falls to the 2nd, I'm all in. Would also love to see them draft David Bell from Purdue. Hes my favorite receiver in this class.

0 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:02 am

I hear ya NickP....loud and clear. Most players currently on the roster, would not speak up now even if they had a complaint or two on #12. Only down the road, where we finally also find the can we kicked (sign Russy B as the official starting punter since he can kick for incredible distance) will/may we hear from players how he really was as a teammate, leader, etc. I am hoping behind the scenes, he is helpful, shows humility and willing to always learn more...

2 points
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Johnblood27's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:36 am

Hell, even his bestie, DA, blew outta town to play with a different QB.

AR is obviously NOT in the same league as Door County as an attraction to GB. He may be slightly ahead of the sledding hill...

8 points
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dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:03 pm

"He may be slightly ahead of the sledding hill..."

Well, until they add big trees, rocks, and fences, that's not much of a sledding hill.

0 points
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Johnblood27's picture

March 25, 2022 at 06:07 pm

You don't get cookies for crashes... just sayin...

1 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:57 am

We dont know what the Packers offered MVS, but I am plenty sure they tried hard as they wanted him. Having a verteran and experienced WR who know the offense makes it much easier when needing another starting WR to plug in and play. Now they need two starting WR's with no experience in the offense.

Find it interesting neither of last years starting WR's wanted to return and play with Rodgers. MVS would have been the featured WR.

Do you recall the five WR's who sat out the mini camp last year (presumably) on behalf of Rodgers? They are all now gone now with exception of Lazard. Funchess, MVS, ESB, Adam's all gone! How did that all work out for them?

7 points
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HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:40 am

MVS leaving had little to nothing to do with playing for Rodgers.....KC gave him 2 years at $18 million with a chance at a third with incentives all the way up to $36 million and still playing with a great QB..... the Packers offered him a 1 year deal.....(didn't see an amount, but guaranteed it wasn't for $9 million.....

2 points
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davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:59 am

Yeah...KC simply put out an offer sheet they knew GB wouldn't/couldn't match. With AR and Adams needing new contracts and costing so much against the cap, MVS had to sit on the back burner for a new contract though he may very well have wanted to stay in GB and play with AR. Less to due with AR and more simply with the cap.

2 points
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LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:32 pm

Agree...MVS simply took the far more lucrative multi-year deal offered by KC in the post Hill era. Playing with Mahomes and a likely playoff team was icing on the cake.

Packers simply could not match that money. I understand it.

2 points
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dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:07 pm

Not to mention, he gets back on the FA market after playing an enhanced role with a good QB before he turns 30...which he can turn into one more payday.

3 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:36 pm

I can’t fault MVS taking that deal at all. I can fault the Packers for putting themselves in a position where they have a 50 million QB and one full time receiver who isn’t going to be a number one. It was entirely foreseeable, is completely ridiculous and we will be paying for it when Rodgers is long gone.

3 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:14 am

Well for MVS, Adams. Wish EQ had stayed out.

1 points
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Rebecca's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:58 pm

Nah, it’s going where the money is. These guys know that a knee / hamstring blows out and a career can get short quickly. The rest is your fantasy about Rodgers.

2 points
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davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:08 am

Great article reply. I would concur with 'pushing all my chips into the center' and taken the Denver offer for AR (along with the Adams' trade)...if it netted the 6 picks. While clearly a gamble, it has upside potential.

It would have meant gambling on Love and/or using the AR 20million in cap savings on getting a mid-tier established QB to run the offense...while seeing what these 6 round 1 and 2 picks could do. While I could see this better positioning GB for the long-term, I can also appreciate that BG chose instead to 'call the bet' (trade Adams) but not go 'all in' (also trade Rodgers) and leave GB with the immediate stability at QB while inviting more risk at QB in a couple years (AR gone but GB not getting the 2022 equivalent draft capital to use to build a better all-around team).

0 points
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Ya_tittle's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:11 pm

LA Times story on the Russell Wilson trade to Denver said the GM there hadn't talked to the Packers about trading for Rodgers in over a year. He was set on getting Russ.

2 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:25 pm

I wouldn’t give credence to that either way after they signed Wilson. Less as I know who they were recruiting to coach.

1 points
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Renllaw's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:10 am

I go back and forth between your take on rebuilding on the fly and the all in for a ring approach. I am hoping that with the 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds this draft we can make the team so good we can win a super bowl and add to our young core to the point where we can continue to win with an average to above average QB when 12 walks. Its harder today, but championships have been won in the past with Foles, over the hill Peyton Maning, Flacco, Eli Manning, Brad Johnson, Dilfer...

Bad news is I dont think any of those teams found their new franchise QB after. So Keep winning while we hunt for the next franchise guy? Maybe, but its not sustainable if we cant find a way to get into the top 10 and try to get that QB.

-3 points
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dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:21 am

This was Ken's quote...

"But if you really look at it, the reality is Green Bay is, and has been, gradually rebuilding under the Gutekunst-LaFleur regime. "

So I'll use that to amplify what you're saying: this team has been in a continuous turnover since BG "took control" of personnel. Every GM has his favorites and pet projects...it may be that we're just seeing BG jettison the TT/RB projects for his own. Whatever the case, the roster today has precious few players as holdovers from the pre-Gutekunst era. This roster has been rolling for three-plus years.

Those draft picks you mention are a huge, low-cost way to inject a boost of young talent into the roster. I have a hunch that one of those top 4 picks will be dealt for a WR in the next couple weeks, but this isn't a team that can wait to see what draft picks blossom in August and still justify the cap-manipulations and investments in the roster made this off-season.

10 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:29 pm

You may be right, but it’s going to be a receiver who is cheap due to the cap, so in his first contract or coming out of a slump. They may just wait for offers and plan to sift through the post draft releases.

1 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:41 pm

It wouldnt even be a "rebuild." They already have Rodgers' replacement with 2 years of learning under his belt. Had they traded both rodgers and adams, they wouldve had 3 1st round picks and 3 2nd round picks this year alone plus 4 more premium picks in '23 as well as Noah Fant and Shelby Miller on the roster. And they wouldve added cap space while keeping the defense completely intact. Thats a reload, not a rebuild. They are absolutely insane for not going this route.

2 points
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Ya_tittle's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:12 pm

See my comment above. Broncos THIS YEAR weren't after Rodgers. They wanted younger.

-1 points
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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:41 pm

Sure. All teams wanted the player they signed for huge money after the fact. It’s odd, since the Seahawks were pretty open about the fact that they initiated discussions and only recently. I assume Denver’s GM was just trusting that they would.

Don’t believe all you read about football, especially this time of year and after the last 12 months of fun.

1 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:07 pm

The hell they werent. Notice they didnt trade for Wilson until AFTER Rodgers announced he was staying with GB. Rodgers was always their first choice and they may have even offered more than they did for Wilson.

2 points
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Roadrunner23's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:21 am

I’m pretty convinced this will be Rodgers last year with the Packers.

Hopefully it ends with a Super Bowl and the Packers can still trade Rodgers for a boatload of picks next year.

If he is allowed to walk and the packers only get a 3td round comp pick……..watch Twitter burn 🔥

-8 points
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Archie's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:42 am

But doesn't the Pack owe him 67MM in 2023 whether he retires, is traded etc.?

3 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:41 am

Thats what i thought too, but after taking another look at overthecap.com i noticed something. If they trade or release him post june 1 of next year, the dead cap money would only be about $30 mil. Im not sure how this adds up but thats what it says. With that being said, if the Packers passed up on 2 1sts, 2 2nds, and 2 good young starting players for only one more year of Rodgers, the entire organization, including the EC, needs to be shown the door.

3 points
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dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:31 pm

My understanding is that a lot of the money is tied up in "option bonuses" which are more "pay-as-you-go". Those can be converted to signing bonuses and provide cap relief in a given year, but they aren't incurred as cap money until you hit their trigger date. Most of those dates are listed in contract details. This is my understanding, anyway.

1 points
1
0
Rossonero's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:34 am

Rebuild, reload, it's all a matter of opinion. As much of a massive loss Adams is, I hope it forces Rodgers to start playing in the boundaries of the offense -- when he does, the Packers win games. When he plays hero ball with Adams, we sometimes win, but do that in the playoffs, and defenses are too good and have us figured out by then.

However, let's not forget the fact that Rodgers said in December, "I won't drag out my decision."

Then he proceeded to drag it out until the verge of free agency.

This franchise had its hands tied behind its back until the first and biggest domino to fall -- Aaron Rodgers.

All they could do was have "what if scenarios" and action plans in place, but it's hard to take any action when Rodgers did, in fact drag it out.

And about Davante Adams -- they offered him the same as the Raiders. So what? If they love him so much, why didn't they make that offer last summer when they were negotiating a new deal? It's kind of like, if you ask for a raise at your job and don't get it, then you get an offer from an outside company, and they offer you, say 20% more (which is realistic these days). Then you go back to your company and they're like "oh yes! we love you, we'll give you 20% more!"

Ok -- well where was the love when you had asked for a raise? Where was the love when they were negotiating last summer? The last ditch, matching offer for Adams was reportedly leaked out of the front office as a last ditch, perhaps PR effort to keep Rodgers happy that the front office tried to keep Adams, full well knowing that his mind was made up anyway.

Wouldn't you be irritated if your company suddenly had the money to make you that offer, but only when another company made a great offer, that they were willing to match it? (assumption here is no budget constraints, as the Packers could have made that offer last summer)

I'm glad we got $20 of cap space, plus two premium picks to gradually start this rebuild, rather than a full tear-down all at once. At least if Rodgers retires or leaves in 2 years, then some of these new chess pieces will be in place to facilitate the transition to Love.

-1 points
4
5
Packerpasty's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:38 am

Adams simply wanted out, he isn't one of Rodgers good friends like Bak or Cobb, more of a family man and west coast type...he could go anywhere he wanted and get payed very well so why not simply up and leave like he did...gets to play with Carr who is one of his friends and be out west in the glitter and sunshine...not a hard decision...

5 points
5
0
dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:15 am

"However, let's not forget the fact that Rodgers said in December, "I won't drag out my decision." Then he proceeded to drag it out until the verge of free agency."

I think he said that he wouldn't drag it out and that he would make his decision by the end of the tagging period...which he did. So in that sense, yes, he dragged it out (and used essentially every minute he'd allotted himself) over the entire portion of the off-season where player movement is mostly stagnant, but as soon as the chips were starting to fall (tampering and the like), he'd gotten off the pot. My issue was more with the teasing he was doing through the media.

In the end, the question had to be whether he was preventing the Packers from signing anyone they wanted to keep, or anyone who was released by another team during that time as a vested free agent, by keeping his cap needs up in the air. He was pretty much in regular contact with management. The Packers retained the pieces they wanted to bring back. I don't think he really kept the Packers from doing much, under the circumstances.

4 points
4
0
Boneman's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:43 am

Ken you just defined football. It's a brutal sport and the window for peak play is pretty small. The QB and the System 'make' the other players great. This has been proven time and time again with O'Dell Beckham being the latest example. How good was he in Cleveland with Baker Mayfield throwing him the ball? He goes to LA and Matt Stafford (with a modern offense) and viola'! Superstar. The pie is only so big every year because of the salary cap so you have to be very judicious in how you divvy it up. Premium positions like QB, Left Tackle, Cornerback and Edge Rusher is where the money must go and the rest is shrewd FA deals and the draft. Also invest money into the organization itself, coaches and facilities, and you have a yearly contender. Good job Pack!

4 points
5
1
Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:44 am

Odell Beckham was not a superstar in LA. He had 1 100 yard game. He played like a good #2.

3 points
3
0
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:59 pm

There were clearly more things going on within the Browns franchise anyway, that much has become public knowledge.

1 points
1
0
RCPackerFan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:49 am

I don't know what the turnover ratio for players is every year, but either way I don't view this team as a rebuild in anyway. Every year there is a certain number of players that will change. However this year the core group of players will be returning. QB, RB, TE, OL (mostly), DL, ILB, OLB, CB, S are going to be essentially the same minus a few changes.

The biggest difference on this roster is the WR position will be overhauled. They lost 3 players already. Adams, MVS and EQ are all playing for someone else next year. Clearly Adams is a huge loss. MVS's deep threat ability will be missed also. I expect them to go fairly hard at WR's in the draft. I wouldn't be surprised if they drafted 2 of them pretty high. They still do have Lazard and Cobb. Rodgers will be entering his 2nd year and should hopefully take a step. Winfree is a guy I do like and think he could take a step as well. But I am expecting them to bring in at least 1 veteran either in FA or via trade. And I do think they will draft a few.

The passing game while it will miss the WR's, we could see a bit of a shift though. Perhaps they find more ways to use the TE's and RB's in the passing game. Tonyan likely won't be ready to start the season, but when he does come back he should make a big impact in the passing game. Don't be surprised if they were to draft a TE also. Find Big faster receiving type that could have an impact on the passing game.

Also, we know Rodgers has had a hard time trusting rookie WR's in the past. Well he doesn't have the Jennings, Nelson, Adams to rely on, so whatever rookie(s) are brought in he will have to learn to trust them quicker. With this offense, they should be able to get on the field faster and contribute.

2 points
2
0
dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:18 am

"They lost 3 players already. Adams, MVS and EQ are all playing for someone else next year."

WR actually catch passes, so for that reason I don't count EQ here... ;)

On a more serious note: he's no loss. Brought very little to the offense and some utility to bad ST units. Utterly replaceable....to the point that you wonder just why they kept bringing him back beyond just the ease of familiarity.

7 points
7
0
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:32 am

I would rather have seen Taylor or Winfree given his snaps as a conventional receiver and have tried AmRod in his option type routes. That way we might have learned something more useful about guys we at least had some plan to bring back on the 90. Just another of LaFleur’s dubious personnel choices, if probably a minor one.

5 points
5
0
LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:56 am

Taylor played better than ESB in the preseason and made the 53 as ESB was cut. He should have played a lot more. ESB gets promoted from the PS and continues to take snaps from Taylor.

I don't understand that either, CW. I was always hoping ESB would step up. I question his football desire. I don't think he works very hard at his craft. Taylor, like Lazard before him, has a lot of "want to" in him. ESB doesn't.

2 points
2
0
Ya_tittle's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:35 pm

Great analysis of ESB. I think you are spot on.

0 points
0
0
Bruiser's picture

March 25, 2022 at 07:54 am

Finding a good receiver or receivers should be easy. The defense is strong and hopefully special teams will be better.

2 points
6
4
dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:20 am

"Finding a good receiver or receivers should be easy."

If you invest enough, sure--either in draft or cap capital. Then there's the aspect of luck...injury, locker room.

I think people said the same things about S after Collins retired and ILB since Bishop left.

3 points
3
0
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:35 am

There is also the question of time. It takes 3 years to judge any draft for a reason. If success is now, finding receivers in the draft who really contribute at a 1 or 2 level is extremely unusual. Yes, it can happen, but it’s not probable at all.

2 points
2
0
davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:19 am

I would amend this to say 'Finding a good receiver or receivers should be EASIER than finding a good player at many other positions.' Every NFL team basically has 3 good receivers - that's almost 100 WRs that teams are getting them from somewhere. Whereas each team might only have 1 good S or ILB - scarcity/harder to replace.

GB's historically had 'good luck' drafting WRs that pan out. Plus, we all sort of believe AR can make a WR look better than he actually is b/c of the accuracy of his throws even when a WR doesn't really get much separation on his routes.

1 points
1
0
Packer_Fan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:04 am

This is not a rebuilding year for the whole team. For WR, yes, but not for the rest of the team. Releasing Turner is more a statement of how much they think the guys they have who are capable than rebuilding.

It was hard to lose Adams, but it turns out key people got retained. Campbell, Douglas and Tonyan. And I really like the signing of Reed. The DL is betters than last year with him versus Lancaster. We have three quality DB's, two quality safety and a pro bowler at ILB.

On offense, I think we are good with Bahk, Runyan, Myers, Newman and Jenkins/Nijman. Tight end group is same as last year. Two good RB's and Rodgers. Yes, we have to do something about WR. Gute has an opportunity for a trade, or picking up a veteran WR from potential releases to come. No one we pick up will replace Adams. He can't be replaced. The offense will need to evolve into something different. And it just may be better.

And we are looking at a new special teams coach with a veteran punter. We can expect an improvement for next year.

Now the draft. Pending if a trade is made, we may not have all 7 picks in the first four rounds. So I say Leo Chenal at ILB (he is top pick). I also see WR, Edge, IDL as high picks. Then OL, DB, Safety depth.

We will see, but I am encouraged.

-1 points
3
4
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:16 am

Chenal is a 2 down run stuffer ILB. They are not sought after in todays’s NFL or in the Barry system when it’s maybe a one down role. If he’s a mid late day 3 pick, fine, but round one would be ridiculous.

5 points
6
1
LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:33 pm

Um, disagree with you on Leo the Lion, CW. He is not a JUST a 2 down run stuffer. While he is ferocious in the run game, Chenal played all 3 downs his entire Badger career.

On the top D in college, Chenal led the Badgers in both 2020 and 2021 in BOTH sacks and TFLs. He was not used in coverage because that would severely hurt the Badger pass rush. He performed very well on all 3 downs against some of the best competition in college. Immense success rushing the passer. Guys like him don't sit on 3rd downs...and he hasn't. Barry would be playing him in pass rushing schemes all over the front 7.

He would be a huge upgrade over Barnes in my view who IS just a 2 down player and times looks lost on run plays.

Chenal might slide to #92/3rd but I doubt it. I would take him at #59/2nd.

-1 points
1
2
dobber's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:55 pm

I love Leo Chenal the college player, but if you put him on the field in the NFL, opponents will deduce ways to attack him in coverage. To be a high-end ILB, he has to fix his deficiencies there. The Badgers used him a lot as an interior rusher or in the stand-up, inside pass-rusher role the Packers liked to use for Z and for Mercilus. He even played OLB, and at his size in college, that was something he could do. He's less special in that regard.

I think it will take a clever DC and good support at S and ILB to find ways to use him in a hybrid role that masks his deficiencies in coverage. He could be an unusual "gadget" ILB in that regard, but I suspect that won't be a priority for teams that draft him. They won't remodel their defense to suit him.

1 points
1
0
HarryHodag's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:25 am

Depth is the issue now after the roster changes. Wide receiver is an obvious hole, but there are others. The core of the team remains but has become much thinner from a depth perspective.

Yes we have Campbell, but who is behind him? Barnes plays the other linebacker. At running back, is Taylor the answer? No contract so far for Jaire and he could bolt after this season, another corner is needed. With Henry Black gone they need another safety. Edge rusher needs at least one. Acquiring Reed actually upgraded the d-line. O-line needs a tackle. The o-line also lost Ben Braden to Denver. Tight end: Tonyan isn't back right away. That is a position they need a starter from the draft.

And last but not least: QB. Love will not ride out three years on the pines. The Packers might well take a flyer late in the draft on a guy like Jack Coan, late of Wisconsin and Notre Dame.

2 points
2
0
LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:00 pm

Love would be the best QB in this draft and Coan isn't any better than Benkert, in fact Benkert would be far better as QB#3 because he knows the system. He will likely be a FA.

If you are hoping for a TE to start this year...there really is not one, except maybe McBride. Even then rookie TEs rarely start. Until Big Bob is 100%, Deguara is going to have to step up...and I think he can.

I agree the need for another ILB. Barnes is a liability, even as a two down player.

2 points
2
0
HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:03 pm

You can chill a bit....a guy or two from last year's draft that didn't play much will be expected to contribute, at least as a third S or fourth CB, and O-line .... and we have ELEVEN draft picks.....if we use them all.....at least 3-4 better be either starters or prime contributors this year and another 3-5 prime ST players.....

0 points
0
0
PackEyedOptimist's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:25 am

One of my recent thoughts on the issue of replacing our WRs, is that with the loss of our talented veterans, Rodgers is going to want/need guys who can learn the system fast AND who have high catch rates. I've been a fan of Christian Watson, but the more I think about it, he has a high drop-rate, which is what really could be a problem.
Just in the last day or two, I've started liking guys like Jahan Dotson, Khalil Shakir, and Bo Melton, all of whom make great catches and seem to be smart WRs.

3 points
3
0
Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:38 am

Watson is also an extremely raw player which worries me more than drops. Hes a developmental player who likely wont make much of an impact this year.

1 points
1
0
LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:47 pm

Watson only had 2 drops last year, his most productive.

He WOULD make an immediate on STs as a KR, possible PR and a gunner on coverage teams. He would contribute as much, or more than MVS did as a rookie, I think. And rookie MVS had 38 receptions and over 500 yards as a rookie...even as he was dropping many targets.

I don't see Watson as a starter but as a important role player on the O and a regular on STs that needs good players too.

1 points
1
0
SanLobo's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:30 am

The truth is, it’s a new team every year. Ask the players, they will tell you the same thing. Changes in coaches, staff and inside the locker room change the dynamics of the team and those changes occur every year. The difference between a reload and a rebuild is a matter of degree. New head coach, GM…team is rebuilding. New QB after losing an elite one (Seattle)…rebuild. New WR room after losing a top 3 WR and half of your WRs….that’s a heavy lift reload, maybe an offensive rebuild. It will be an interesting year whatever you want to call it.

3 points
3
0
frankthefork's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:07 am

Oceans and Lobo are right! You rebuild and reload 10-15 new players every year-half from the draft, and a few from FA and some UDFA too. And next year, with the FA comp system, the Packers can have 11 plus picks or more again. Thanks to MVS, Burks, Z. Smith, Turner, Sullivan, St Brown, and Yaidom for their services and ability to carry on elsewhere.

NFL Football is a twenty to thirty-year older's game, except for QB and K for the most part. We should get used to it. Youthful players lack experience but recover better, run faster, and are much stronger. The bonus is they also come in cheaper. I am all for a reload-rebuild yearly, and every year I suggest a trade back in the draft to find the talent...but that's just me! GB is fine but a WR1, and will still lead the North unless any major injuries to skill players. Just r-e-l-a-x, and run those mock drafts for it's a month away...yeeha.

Remember this...life as is football, is a marathon that requires balance, pace, and a plan.

0 points
3
3
HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:08 pm

Ummmm, I like your thought process but....guys that are cut do NOT count towards comp picks..... HOWEVER, you missed one that will bring us a better comp pick than the rest combined...... Adams is a guaranteed 3rd.....

-1 points
0
1
tgree's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:27 pm

Ummmm.. If you are referring to Devante Adams, and the Packers receiving a comp pick for him, yea thats not going to happen. You don't get trade picks and comp picks. He was traded not left via free agency.

0 points
0
0
packer132's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:35 am

I wouldn't call it a rebuild, as every year team's turnover about 20-25% of their roster. Packers have done a good job of replacing older offensive linemen with drafting good and versatile young guys. Now it needs to be done with the WR's, and I still think a free agent or two comes in. Some fans want OBJ who will miss most of the season to injury or other expensive guys. So far, I feel the $20 million from Adams has helped immensely with re-signing Campbell, Douglas, Tonyan, and picking up DL Reed. I am excited to have that many high draft picks and its just a wait and see now.

5 points
5
0
davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:26 am

Maybe losing Adams (who, remember, WANTED OUT of Green Bay to play with his buddy Carr anyway...) will cripple GB, but...the trade has made this happen:

GB now able to retain: Campbell, Douglas, Tonyan
GB now able to get: Reed
GB now has an extra #1 and #2

That's a HUGE return for losing Adams. At least 3 good starters for Adams.
On paper, I'm really okay with how this seems to have worked out.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:45 am

When you pay more cap than you can afford for one player then it’s inherently going to force restocking. The strange and incongruous fact here is that you pay a QB knowing there is a strong possibility (now reality) that the consequence will be a barren WR room.

In my view the Packers have ended up with a scenario that is ridiculous. A massively paid QB and no money to invest in experienced catchers beyond a 3/4 RFA, A TE coming back off an ACL (hopefully early) and a 32 year old slot with dubious ability to stay healthy and effectively now zero money to spend on reinforcements.

If any other team did that we’d be laughing. What little money we spent has gone mostly on the D and a hopeful return of Tonyan. We are all pinning our hoped on early draft picks, the success rate of which is about 50 percent for first rounders and that’s on s 2-3 year viewing. We may find a reclamation project or two, if we are lucky.

This situation is leading to many increasingly stretching the bounds of credibility to find a “rational” justification. It is in fact the opposite. It will take a miracle to avoid the worst catching corps in decades in a year while we offered a 38 year old QB the farm for as long as he wants it and paid for it with future cap and opportunity.

It’s very simple, you don’t mortgage the future for a QB that you can’t provide weapons to. You don’t pay a QB that much for a team led by RBs on O and when your strength is greatest on D. Yet that is exactly what we have done.

The contradictions between how the roster has developed beyond Rodgers and the frankly craven willingness to cede to his demands is striking. Gute’s general moves and the Rodgers signing are at odds. It looks to me as if Murphy ordained keeping Rodgers at all costs when common sense screams we could not afford it and a viable roster now and less so later.

Rodgers is merely taking money at this point, it’s fairly obvious. He didn’t come back demanding weapons to resign. He just wanted to be paid and the freedom to walk on a whim, regardless of the health of the Packers. Well he got what he wanted off the field at the price of an arsenal of weapons that might have caused him to leave in the past.

Bravo Packers, a mercenary QB and a team built to run, paid for by void years galore. This organization is knee deep in contradictions not sneakily clever, though I think Gute’s doing all he can. This is not how to run a team, this is what happens when the senior leader messes up otherwise sound work. It isn’t rational it’s at war with itself.

2 points
10
8
croatpackfan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:45 am

Coldworld, you are preaching to deaf. Very few will read this post with understanding. Second, you dare to question highest God in Packers nation. People believe he is nice person. But he is liar, he is egoist, he, simply, do not care about other.

Something what Oppy wrote is something in line with my understanding. Players leaves Packers for more money and respect because they deep into themselves knows this story of another last dance and winning SB is not possible with Diva. For the reasons they are much more informed than we, as fans, are.

Regarding lies Diva placed in the last 2 months are:
- On the MVP ceremony Diva clearly said that he will come with decision in the next 2 weeks (we all knows it lasted 5 weeks);
- When he was asked about future contract, he said he will sign team friendly contract (sic!);
- When was reported that it is contract for 4 years and $200 mill he stated it is not, but it was year shorter for the same average of $50 mill/y;
- he clearly said that he will not be part of rebuilding, but he is, at least rebuilding on the offensive side of the ball (he signed contract knowing that he will lose DA).

I suppose MVS and ESB waited to see if AR is staying and than decided to go somewhere else.

There is so many points that shows us something is not good in the Packers locker room. I hope I am wrong if not for any other reason, but because of Packer Nation.

I also suspect Diva was "negotiating" with some other franchises, but no one would pay him by his request, except Packers. That is the reason why he is "decided" to stay, even to be part of the offensive rebuild.

4 points
6
2
Swisch's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:51 am

What's sad is that Gute has made so many good moves as our GM, but will likely lose almost all of that good work by groveling before Rodgers.
Gute has to stand up for himself if he's being pressured by another Packers executive to accommodate Rodgers to such a embarrassing degree.
After three seasons in a row of 13 wins, plus two playoff victories, Gute would get hired as a GM by another team if the Packers forced him out.
***
Anyway, your thoughtful commentary is appreciated, Coldworld.
It does seem Rodgers is a mercenary by the way he's acted the past two off-seasons as being perfectly willing to walk away from the Packers and holding us hostage to his whims.
I don't see how the Packers can ever win a championship with such a selfish quarterback. Rodgers has to change with a large measure of humility for the Packers to function as a healthy team.
One would think his failures in the playoffs against the Bucs and 49ers the past two seasons would have him reassessing himself. Apparently not.
While I don't know why Adams and MVS left, I know I wouldn't want to stay with a team in which such a self-absorbed jerk is allowed to be so domineering.
That may seem negative, but to me it's simply a realistic look at the situation.
I'm glad for any positive evidence about Rodgers to give me a more cheerful outlook on the future of the Packers.

4 points
7
3
Johnblood27's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:52 am

CW, you described a short-timer mentality.

That is Murphy exactly.

He has 3 years to mandatory retirement. He wants Rodgers for those 3 years, not a developmental QB. He wants confetti at the end of his term, not just a ride down the sledding hill on a toboggan.

You are right, it all starts at the top. Mm demanded that BG keep the QB at all costs and that has led us to where we are.

6 points
8
2
Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:33 pm

Agree with your points here about Murphy, Johnblood. But im gonna take it a step further. Money. Its always about money. When you consider that they just kneeled to keep Rodgers and add that to the recent stock sale, its clear theyre motivated by money. And heres why. The Titletown District. They have so much invested already and after losing a ton of money in the 2020 covid year, theyre terrified of how much money a "rebuilding" year with Love under center could lose them. They invested too much too soon and now theyre making desperate decisions that are guaranteed to lead to catastrophic consequences for the on field product in the not so distant future. Its always about money, even for a non-profit organization like the Packers.

2 points
3
1
greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:47 pm

RTS, that’s the dark side of this that I fight internally to acknowledge.

A lot smells rotten in Denmark, IMHO, regarding so much of what we’ve seen. Rabbit holes I’m unwilling to venture down into.

1 points
2
1
LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:01 pm

Agree JB. My concern is Murphy waded into the Rodgers situation and directed Gutey to retain Rodgers at all costs. I can see Gutey wanting to move on and knew he could get a Diva's ransom in a trade...but he was overruled by MM.

The Rodgers deal locked the Packers in a cap cage along with a dead money nuclear bomb. And Rodgers holds the "nuclear football", so to speak.

I know many believe Rodgers is guaranteed to play for the next 3 years. I believe odds of him retiring after 2022 are as great as him playing in 2023. He is a fickle guy and has flirted with retirement the last two offseasons.

3 points
4
1
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:11 am

Coldworld,
Well stated! Totally agree but believe we have to exercise patience as the last chapter has not been said. There are still things that might happen that we don't know yet.

1 points
2
1
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:54 pm

Absolutely. Miracles can happen, but I’m not going to pretend that they are likely in the face of the facts just because I wish things were otherwise.

Nor am I not going to point out that the arrival at a point where we have a 50 million QB and the most singular lack of both cap room and WRs was the natural outcome of the teams actions and yet is quite the most ridiculous position for a franchise to put itself in. This is no cunning plan, it’s the result of incoherence.

0 points
1
1
HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:13 pm

First, let's see how it all shakes out..... secondly and more importantly..... Rodgers' deal had very little to nothing to do with Adams leaving.....per many reports, and Adams did NOT refute, the Packers offered more and HE chose to leave.....

-1 points
1
2
Packerpasty's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:43 am

I'm sure Gute's will do SOMETHING about the WR situation...it was viewed as mediocre before Adams left now its downright bad...as it stands its the worst WR group in the division and probably close worst in the NFL...take off the green and gold glasses and name a team with a worse grouping than the Packers..and not to mention TE's which isn't very formidable either...no one knows how Tonyan will be after a very bad injury...yup, the Packers brain trust has lots of work to do...

1 points
5
4
HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:16 pm

How about we don't over react to having the worst WR room in the NFL with lesser FA available, draft capital to trade for a better option, and for God's sake....we haven't had the draft yet.....

0 points
0
0
greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 08:55 am

This is a really great article, Ken.

While many see 12 here through the next 3 years, after which point our salary cap becomes a complete dumpster fire, my wishes are for the Packers to trade him now, while his value remains high.

I wouldn’t be surprised if terms of a trade are agreed to in principle on draft day, with finalization of any deal happening after June 1st, when the dead cap hit drops below $30M. Personally, I think that’s the smart play.

NYG are loaded with top picks/players to pull a deal like that off, and they are QB starved, in a very, very weak QB draft (highly questionable if there are 2 QBs worthy of an R1 grade in this class, from what I’m seeing).

If not, I’ll continue to wish our Packers, with 12 at QB, the best moving forward.

1 points
4
3
Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:21 am

I just don’t think the force that caused the Rodgers contract to happen will let them trade him. This team is going in two different and conflicting directions.

I do accept that your solution would resolve that, though I’m not clear on the cap hit of a trade now and if that cap hit preludes doing so, I suspect that it does.

4 points
5
1
Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:23 pm

The earliest they can move Rodgers without an astronomical dead cap hit would be 2023 post june 1st. That would only (LOL) be about $30 million in dead cap. Any trade sooner would be $99 million at the least. I absolutely agree about this team heading in 2 different directions. Murphy/EC faction vs Gute/MLF faction. We saw which side won. Sigh.

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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:31 pm

I believe the dead cap figure after June 1st is in fact $29,648,569. Any help here to confirm would be appreciated.

No harm intended, RTS. You’re using OTC, I’m using sportrac.

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:45 pm

I checked again and you are correct. Doesnt make much sense for them to wait till after the draft to trade him tho. Why not just take the Denver deal when they had the chance? Dont get me wrong, id still be happy just to have him gone but i just dont see it happening. I hope im wrong tho.

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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:33 pm

You and I both know we’d be happy if they chose to make a trade, get a boatload of assets for the future and eat the cap hit now, rather than prolong the suffering.

Maybe. Maybe, they can pull it off and win another Super Bowl in 2022-23 season. I struggle to see it, but like our D, like our running game, like our OL… we’ll see.

btw, I agree with you too. I have doubts about them making what I think would be their best choice: trade now.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:47 pm

Greengold, so your sayin there's a chance! Man, I sure like how you think and would be pumped if a trade were to happen. Eat the cap now can't taste any worse than my home cookin anyways...

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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:12 pm

Whoosh! I’m sadly resigned to the facts many point to re: stock sale…

However, I DO think there’s a chance. Do you know why?
MONEY FUCKING TALKS. $$$$$$$$$

We’re all of a sudden not just talking about the Packers in terms of scope and monetary impact, if the scenario I suspect with NYG plays out. This shit show we’ve known of the past 10 months would transform into heightened league-wide revenues, with NYG being such a HUGE market, should the Packers & Giants agree to a trade for Aaron Rodgers. The stockholders will be just fine, and there are no refunds. I checked… after they traded Flynn….

12’s face would be plastered on EVERYTHING!

Green Bay would quietly retreat out of the limelight. arms laden with picks & players like Homer Simpson with an armload of donuts into the neighbor’s hedge.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:17 pm

Yes, you are the modern day Paul Harvey! Go, go, gooo....

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BruceC1960's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:30 am

Who do you think the trade partner is? Haven’t most teams solved their QB issue? I can’t see 12 agreeing to go to the Giants or Panthers. I suppose the Steelers could still be in play. Hard to believe they would go with Trubisky.
Is a trade after June 1 even a possibility or just a hope?

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:20 pm

He doesnt have a no-trade clause so they could theoretically trade him wherever they want but the dead cap hit would equal doomsday for this team.

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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:36 pm

TGR, could you weigh in here to clarify? OTC has RTS’s figure. sportrac states the cap hit is $29,648,569 after June 1, 2022.

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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:09 pm

That’s why I avoided being specific. I can’t determine which is the right (or closest) interpretation. Therefore err in favor of caution.

I find it darkly amusing that this team is so obviously shaped to be run with a cheaper QB. Run strength, strong D and seemingly inexperienced catching corps. Take players and picks next year, throw Love, Benkert and whomever. With this WR corps the outcome likely isn’t that different this year and may be a lot better next.

Of course, we missed the most obvious window to get the best deal, so probably would founder on Murphy again. Murphy’s Law has a sickly resonating echo in my mind.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:51 pm

Thinking it is slim at best with the signed contract in place. But, trade go go gadget arm to the Vikes for Jefferson. Now, that would make the season rather interesting. Grab a Leines, turn the volume off on the TV, somehow turn on the radio and listen to Jim Irwin and Max Magee call the game = kinda like heaven. Similar to Bob Uecker (sp?) calling the Brewers games.

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davekenya's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:33 am

Can't trade AR now due to accelerated cap hit. The 'trade bridge' was crossed when his new contract was signed.

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:18 pm

Rodgers cant be traded now. It would cost $120 million in dead cap money that would have to be paid this year. It would be doomsday for this team. Even if they cut every player on the roster, they still wouldnt be able to get under the salary cap due to all the dead cap money they would owe. And not getting under the salary cap equald severe consequences such as lost draft picks, etc. Trust me, I want 12 gone as much as any Packer fan alive, but its not happening. Not after they gave him that ridiculous contract. He owns them now and it makes me want to vomit.

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Since'61's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:11 am

Actually the one constant throughout the Lombardi era was their OL. Except for Jim Ringo who was replaced by Ken Bowman the Packers OL was the same throughout the Lombardi era. They won games even when Starr was out with injuries and they won after Hornung and Taylor had moved on. To the point where in 1967 the Packers won there 3rd consecutive NFL championship with Chuck Mercein and Ben Wilson as starting RBs.

Take nothing from Starr but the OL made the offense go regardless of the RBs or the QB. Also Lombardi's defense was always rock solid, allowing only 9.7 PPG in the post season.

The difference in the current era is that there is Free Agency and a Salary Cap. Lombardi never had to deal with either, otherwise players would have been as mobile as they are today. The Packers are retooling or re-engineering rather than rebuilding. The most significant difference will be in their WR group and probably their TE group. Until we get through FA and the draft we won't know how much of retooling the Packers have completed. Thanks, Since '61

7 points
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HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:20 pm

FINALLY, someone not jumping off a cliff.....the D is better with Alexander back and the D line addition..... the O is fine outside of WR..... with a trade possible AND possibly 11 draft picks..... let's wait til June/July before we panic.....

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Since'61's picture

March 25, 2022 at 04:07 pm

HDbikerguy, you are relatively new here but I never jump off a cliff during all the off-season hype, mania and click bait. Wait until one week before the regular season, when we actually know who is on the roster before I assess our chances for the upcoming season.

There are just too many moving parts and too many variables to either panic or get excited about at this point. Sit tight, hope for the best and prepare for the worst. In any case we support the Packers. Thanks, Since ‘61

1 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:22 am

Now, I have been told (a time or ten) that my driveway doesn't go all the way to the garage... so, just throwing this out there. I wonder with the timing of the recent stock sale that MM/EC felt they almost had to sign Rodgers so as to not have the recent buyers of G-stock fuming that they spent all that $ and then...poof, Rodgers gets traded followed by a couple potential down years...I ain't sayin, just saying....

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:13 pm

It would cost the Packers $120 million in dead cap money (all of which would have to be paid this year) if they traded 12. You're on the right track with the timing of the stock sale but it all has to do with the Titletown District. Theyve invested a serious amount of money and after losing a ton of money in the 2020 covid season theyre terrified of how much they could lose in a "rebuild" year with Love under center. Mark Murphy's mandatory retirement age also comes into imho. He wants another ring for his legacy on his way out the door and no longer cares about the longterm health of this team.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:17 pm

Thanks R-T-S, I appreciate your thoughts...

1 points
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greengold's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:51 pm

Damn. Too spot on to ignore. Now, about the Packers… LOL

hoof, been around nearly 6 decades. That driveway to the garage thing? Chef’s kiss.

1 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:03 pm

Thanks greengold. Everytime, well almost everytime...when I see you post, I cringe a tad. Only because it reminds me of a book I bought in Mpls. It was signed by big Ray, Lynn Dickey and another person which I can't recall. The cringe is due to me selling the book after a few years. Ray is such an iconic Packer...one of my favorites! He signed it and at the very end wrote Go Pack Go!

A while back, I visited the Packer HOF. There is a big hole on the top of a Packer helmet. It explains that during high winds a metal tower blew down during a Packers practice. There was a player laying on the field. As the story goes, Coach Lombardi asked a few players who was the person lying on the field that got clipped by the fallen tower. Someone yelled back, It's Nitszche...to which Lombardi said, everyone back to practice, don't worry about 66...nothing can hurt that SOB (or, something like that) :)

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BirdDogUni's picture

March 25, 2022 at 09:35 am

I'd conclude 11 draft picks is a subtle roster revamp in and of itself.

I was happy with 9 draft picks, and then Gutey had the balls to tag-n-trade DA for an extra 1st and 2nd round picks.

Masterful job Gute!

9 points
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TarynsEyes's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:08 am

This article is meant for the naive fan as it attempts to encapsulate the past into the present to project an all is good or that the desire/leadership of the past resides in the present team. This team is not being led by a field general but by a mercenary, and that mercenary turned on his men until the FO paid the fee to have that mercenary do again what he has failed to do over and over, lead his men to victory. The more you pay a mercenary the less you'll get for the money because it's about money for those types, and not the end result because the result is never guaranteed and mercenaries only guarantee themselves a payday Congrats to the FO, you have overpaid a failed mercenary who folds when he needs to earn his money in the real campaign of competitive battle, again.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:16 am

TEyes....yes. the first two letters in mercenary are ME.

Bout sums it up

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Since'61's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:30 am

Taryn, but in this case continuing to pay the mercenary guarantees the jobs of the FO for as long as the mercenary remains in Green Bay. And even beyond that if the mercenary does actually succeed in the playoffs.

TT and MM turned the 2010 SB victory into 6 more seasons and it was enough for MM to leverage into his current HC role with Dallas.

If the Packers do win the SB in the next 1-3 seasons expect Murphy to retire and go out on top and take credit for the SB and the investment in Titletown. Also we can expect Gute to take Murphy's position, Ball to GM and MLF to be extended as MM was.

Failure, which is always orphan, will be blamed on Rodgers or possibly MLF, while success which always has many fathers, will reward the FO, MLF and Rodgers. They have bet on the mercenary they know rather than the mercenary they don't know. Stay safe. Thanks, Since '61

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Coldworld's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:39 am

Does it? If this team fails this year I can see a strong chance it all falls apart acrimoniously. Currently I think that’s the most likely outcome absent Gute having the luck of the ages.

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TarynsEyes's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:24 am

Rodgers wasn't a mercenary when he won the SB and helped TT and the FO kept their jobs for 6 more years. He became one slowly but surely after the MM firing.

This mercenary took a majority of the money and created a crew of limited ability, but less a miracle, this team will not win, less be a participant in the SB. Miracles aren't interventions from unseen forces. They're a result of unexpected actions by the participants in an event.

The Packers, at the moment, do not have the participants to create the actions needed to create the 'miracle' needed to justify this payday for Rodgers.

The FO has shown it doesn't care about tossing good money for more failure at the expense of a future not needing a miracle to be a winner.

3 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

March 25, 2022 at 05:22 pm

In addition, they got a re-up after the 2014 debacle by the space needle....All's Well that ends well for the "risk" takers.

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croatpackfan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:29 am

Tarynseyes, while I agree with your point of view, I will add only this - When leaders lack vision, they rely on the hope that things will improve on their own, forgetting Murphy’s first law (Things left to themselves, go from bad to worse!).

3 points
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TarynsEyes's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:19 pm

Yes. It's one thing to have hope, but it's a completely different thing to rely on it as a savior.

I hope I win the lottery, but I don't rely on that hope to live on.

2 points
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HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:32 am

Come on Ken, by these standards basing players from 2019 to going into the 2022 season.... EVERY team is rebuilding.... averaging 7 new picks a year, that is 28 new guys of which 15-20 BETTER replace guys..... and with a hard cap..... you HAVE to go cheaper in places.....

2 points
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EricinGB's picture

March 25, 2022 at 10:36 am

Rebuild? The defense is back and stronger. Special Teams has arguably the best coaching staff in the NFL now...if we had another stud defensive lineman and a stronger special teams for the playoff last season (like we have now), we would have dominated. Yes, we lost linemen and wide receivers this offseason...but given what we have added including our draft capital, it is fair to argue that the Packers on balance could be stronger this year come playoff time when younger players have had a full 17 games experience In the offense...and it's fair to assume we will have a ticket into the playoffs...at that time anything can happen... and with our 2nd year defense even stronger than last season, and Rodgers under center, I like our chances.

-2 points
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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:09 pm

The offense could only manage 53 yds in the 2nd half of the playoff game vs 49ers. Thats why they lost.

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HDbikerguy's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:26 pm

That didn't help BUT..... without the TOTAL disaster that was STs....... that 53 yards was still enough to win....... and by two scores.....

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Return_To_Sanity's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:40 pm

Those 53 yds represent everything wrong with this team. Everything is built around a guy who continually falls apart when the team needs him to be great. And then everyone else gets blamed but him. For years it was the defense. Now its lack of receivers or special teams. The constant through all the playoff disappointments has been Rodgers. And the disappointments shall continue.

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croatpackfan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:58 pm

That ST disaster would never happened if offense did their job. There would not be punting from 10 yards in own territory or missed FG would not do any problems. Wake up. The main problem is choker and servant attitude of MLF. Nobody and nothing else.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:08 am

Shoot...with all that money Super Turbo 12 gets, we can't afford cheerleaders or a mascot!!!!!!!! :D

What I truly love are the male/female cheerleaders from the local community college. They seem genuine and down-to-earth. I had to smile with pride a few years ago while attending a game at Lambeau. There was an attractive cheerleader (they all are attractive in their own, unique way)...but she was a looker. The gloves she was wearing were Hardware Hank gloves...I knew right then and there, I was in the right place for me! GPG...!

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Alberta_Packer's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:41 am

Rebuild? Rebuild what? The same team as last year - which is currently less than what it was - with little cap room for player upgrades? Rodgers salary is the very meaning of throwing good money after bad. It's actually deplorable to see the FO of a professional sports franchise squander a golden opportunity for a timely team re-generation.

5 points
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croatpackfan's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:59 pm

But, but, but Diva said he will sign team friendly contract!

1 points
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Alberta_Packer's picture

March 25, 2022 at 06:05 pm

:) - Just another one of Rodger's misdirection plays.

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JQ's picture

March 25, 2022 at 11:57 am

Thanks Ken! As usual your story is thoughtfully written and interesting.
As for the Packers replenishing the Wide Receiver position-stay tuned, film at 11...

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LambeauPlain's picture

March 25, 2022 at 12:24 pm

Well, with MVS gone, I now can see the Packers drafting a WR with a 1st, 2nd, and in third or #132/4th.

Dream Weaver hope:

Olave or Burks round 1.

Christian Watson 2nd (will have high probability of contributing right away on all ST units...especially as a KR and gunner. Maybe even at PR.

Then in round 3 or 4, Tolbert or Doubs.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

March 25, 2022 at 01:29 pm

Thanks for the article Ken. I am not so much concerned about the Lass word as I am intrigued by who gets the Lass laugh.

Okay; I owe, I owe...so off to work I go....

1 points
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Duneslick's picture

March 25, 2022 at 02:10 pm

So what did we get for Adams a first rd pick a second round pick and cap money to sign Campbell, Douglass Tonyan Reed. I would say it was a great trade

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