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Packers Mock Draft Monday 9.0

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Packers Mock Draft Monday 9.0

Ross will provide a semi-weekly roundup of national mock drafts relating to the Packers picks.  He's gone back to using Fanspeak's On the Clock and will continue to rotate in the two major mock draft programs.  In 2019 the Packers will pick six times in the first four rounds, so those are the rounds that we will focus on.

I used CBS's aggregate board.  This of course rounds up a bunch of boards from around the internet and comes up with something of a consensus.  Despite the fact that the Packes added two edge rushers in free agency, they are maulers.  I added a burner, and a player with a higher ceiling than either Smith.  Devin Bush is the linebacker of the future, and a welcome addition to a competition with Oren Burks and a special teams unit in need of playmakers.  Samuel immediately slidees in for Cobb and Thornhill provides a freak athlete with cornerback and free safety experience.  Saunders and Hill are also very much plus athletes, a Packers staple.  TE is left unadressed until the fifth round with an emphasis on replacing Graham with a top 90 pick in 2020.

Roundup

Benjamin Solak, The Draft Network -- TJ Hockenson and Jon Abram - This is certainly the kind of draft Green Bay is capable of having after this free agency period.  Taking Hockenson at 12 and getting it over with is as good a plan as any.  As far as Abram is concerned the guy is an absolute lunatic.  A true tone setter for the defense and a re-do on the Josh Jones pick.  I don't have a round one grade on him (and neither does Ben), but he certanily fills a need.

Joe Marino, The Draft Network -- Burns and Noah Fant - Burns and Fant were a very popular combination prior to free agency.  That doesn't mean that they still don't make a ton of sense, becuase they do.  As I mentioned above, Burns is a very different pass rusher than the ones Green Bay has now.   Marino did take Fant over Hockenson, which I wouldn't do, but some would.

Ryan Wilson, CBS -- Cody Ford and Dalton Risner and Taylor Rapp- absolutely not.  The Packers just committed to a minimum of two years of Billy Turner and have Lane Taylor on an extremely team friendly contract.  Take an offensive lineman in round one?  Sure.  Green Bay hardly ever does it but sure.  Use a once in a decade chance to pick twice in round one to take two guys who definitely can't play left tackle?  All three are sub-7.5 RAS guys and unlikely Packers targets.  Get out.

Joe Tansey, Bleacher Report -- Greedy Williams and TJ Hockenson - now this is the spice that I can get behind.  Williams gives the Packers another high-level swing at cornerback after the loss of Bashaud Breeland.  If Josh Jackson doesn't work out at corner and needs to play free safety, Greedy can play there.  If Kevin King goes down again Greedy can play there.  There is no such thing in this world as too many cornerbacks.  

Todd McShay, ESPN (+) -- Hockenson and Burns - these guys might be in an unrealistic order, I think it's likely that Burns would be the pick at 12 and then one would hope Hockenson lasts until 30, but either way moving out of Thursday with these two players it's an enormous win.

Dan Kadar, Mocking the Draft, SB Nation -- Fant and Chris Lindstrom - I don't love it, I don't hate it.  Lindstrom is the archetype Packers offensive lineman.  Played tackle, played college ball in the cold, and is a super-elite athlete.  Everything but the phrase "played tackle" applies to Fant as well.

Charles Davis, NFL.com -- Christian Wiklins and Dalton Risner - What the hell? 

Ben Standig, NBC Sports -- Burns and Fant - Huzzah!

Packers Draft Prospect Vid of the Week (no highlights)- 

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Ross Uglem is a staff writer for Cheesehead TV. He can be found on Twitter @RossUglem 

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (151) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

FTS Messamore's picture

1-Ed Oliver DL, 1-N’Keal Harry WR, 2-Bennie Snell RB

FTS Messamore's picture

I like Snell for us but after doing some research I see he has fallen a bit. So I will change to OL Dalton Risener.

jannes bjornson's picture

I also have been in Snell's camp. He had a twp rating coming into the off-season. He is a power back with feet. He went u[ against the best defenses in the country facing Alabama, LSU, Miss State and Florida for three years.
He will move the chains and keep your offense on the field. The Bama backs will go in the first or high twos. The back s from OKState and Iowa State are already on your roster. If you want to WIN you have to secure Home Field and bring the opponent through weather. Coughlin did it twice to MM away from his turf and helped destroy the Lambeau Mystique. He ran the ball and established play action. Well, anyway, He was moving into the third round because Some writers think a guy 5'-11 and 220 should run faster than a 4.6. He's similar to Frank Gore. Just an
indestructible guy, signed by Buffalo. He may have to be selected in the second round. That's why and trade down a couple spots may work, if a team wants a QB and pick up an extra two pick?

PeteK's picture

In essence we have that in Williams. Three yds and a cloud of dust. I prefer Miles Sanders out of Penn St because he can do it all.

jannes bjornson's picture

Saunders and Snell are similar. Either guy is fine. Williams does not compare to Snell. Snell has change of pace and decisive cutting abilty. He is not a Mccarthy one cut runner.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

If either Joe Marino or Todd McShay's mock draft worked out that way I'd be extremely happy. Ross Uglem draft I would be happy with too!

Interesting no mention of Oliver. Must think he wont last.

Ross Uglem's picture

he was off the board when I selected.

Rak47's picture

Why in the heck do you and everyone else it seems keep mocking Justice Hill to GB. The guy is 5'10 190 lbs, he's freaking smaller than Aaron Jones, seriously? The last thing we need is another midget on the injury report every week. Packers need a bigger back who can run and catch like David Montgomery, Mike Sanders, or Damien Harris not another skinny pencil that going to spend half his contract on the injury report. What's he gonna do imitate Jones on the field and in the trainer's room? Please stop with the Justice Hill nonsense.

dobber's picture

If the Packers are as serious as it sounds at getting their RBs to the edge on zone runs, they need RBs who can do it. Most of those guys aren't thumpers. A 5th on Justice Hill? I don't see how that's anything to complain about.

Minniman's picture

I still think that the RB Holyfield as a round 6 or 7 dark horse may add a better player to the Packers than his combine 40 time suggests. I'd still like to see his 10-yard split and 3-cone drill to convince me that he's the twitchy and elusive runner that we see on tape (just not with the top end speed); but he's certainly a rugged and elusive runner in traffic and could be a good compliment to Jones and Williams to keep the chains moving...... granted, he's certainly not a RB1 though.

jannes bjornson's picture

Cone drills don't tackle you.

Minniman's picture

That's probably Holyfield's strength Jannes - the fact that he doesn't shy away from contact. Interestingly I went back and looked at his stats for last year - he averaged 6.2 yards per carry. Nothing eye popping there. I also looked at the 2 important games that they lost in order to see how he went when the going was tough (SEC championship game to Alabama and the Sugar Bowl game to LSU). He averaged 4.3 ypc against Bama and 5.2 ypc against LSU (14 and 12 carries [respectively]) - solid numbers on a losing team against good opposition.

Sure every team covets that back that can turn a break into 7 points - he probably won't be that guy, but in a rotation with Jones and Williams he would be a consistent threat and make opponents defenses consistently respect the run and allow Rodgers to do his thing - and he'd do that probably via a 6th or 7th round pick.

jeepingmakooi's picture

No but they show how quick your feet are in close quarters. And they show burst off a cut..

Hawg Hanner's picture

Have the Packers ever had a RB that small? I agree I want a guy who can move the pile forward.

Old School's picture

A pile mover would be very useful. Those 3rd and 1 runs don't make the highlight reel but they keep your offense on the field.

fthisJack's picture

wasn't Lacey supposed to be a pile mover? how that work out. the pile mover is the OL. if they can't move the pile then the play is doomed! Justis Hill in round 4!

Ziff Davis's picture

Jeez a little harsh maybe? He's a good player. Might have to be creative to find out how to use him, but I'd take the chance on a 90-something percentile athlete at the position even if he's maybe an inch or two short and lighter than the ideal height Maybe that's just me....

fthisJack's picture

do you have a problem with Jones? if not then another guy to speel him would be a plus especially in the 4th round! or do you want another Eddie Lacey?

Mcdaws's picture

I love the burns, bush, Samuel, Thornhill, hill, don’t know Saunders.

Who will be the slot this year? I kind of like the Isabella look but you never know how impactful rookies will be, may not see it until year two

Ross Uglem's picture

Equanemeous has tremendous potential as a "big slot". Davante is also lethal from the slot. Shanahan/LaFleur actually uses the slot a lot less than McVay.

Jonathan Spader's picture

Jimmy Graham can also line up in the slot as a "big slot".

PeteK's picture

You mean big slug ? lol Let's not forget Kumerow as a possibility in the slot.

Old School's picture

We're going to be running more double TE sets. I'm not sure we'll need a slot on the field a lot.

If we run more, if we throw to the backs more, if we throw to the TEs more...….that means somebody gets thrown to less. Adams? The other WR? Or the slot guy?

jannes bjornson's picture

Move the chains and run more plays, hit everybody. Make the D reactors.

jeremyjjbrown's picture

If you do 11 personnel with narrow splits having a "true" slot is less important than RBs and TEs who can participate in the passing game. Even so, the Titans used 11 personnel less than all but 6 teams last year (44%). So I'm not expecting them to draft a "true" slot high at all. Jimmy Graham is likely to be in the slot the most.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Ross....Good info!

Mcdaws's picture

Do you want Davante inside? Who would be your outside in3 wr sets?

fthisJack's picture

no...don't need Adams in the slot taking a beating. he is great RAC on the outside. why mess that dynamic up? sheesh.

fthisJack's picture

i like the smaller quick twitch slot guys. give me Isabella, Samuel, Brown.

JakeDickerson's picture

I would take this draft anyday. I would only hope that Adderley was available at 44 and snag him there. Then try for another slot guy in the next round. Isabella maybe? The Fourth round selections are great value picks. Wouldn’t mind some OL depth somewhere on the draft.

sonomaca's picture

Ben Solak has Burns going to Jags at #7. Greedy also gone in his mock. If this comes to pass, Pack can take Hock (or Metcalf), or trade down.

We know Gute likes speed, so I’m thinking he would pick Metcalf, a true athletic freak.

Lare's picture

The Packers will be taking an offensive lineman with one of their first 6 picks. I predict Lindstrom at 30.

jannes bjornson's picture

He may go higher. A lot of teams need Oline and he had a good Combine.

Guam's picture

Had the same reaction you did Lare, six picks and no help for the O-line? Turner will help, but we need some much better depth than we presently have. Would much prefer an O-lineman at #44 than a WR.

fthisJack's picture

Risner solid at 30.

jeepingmakooi's picture

Alex and nico are not guys to sleep on... You guys forget about people because you don't see them all the time... Gute has made it so he can draft pretty much any position in April and it be meaningful.. there are only a few top oline guys and there will probably only be one if any left at 30.. I would pick something else where we can get an impact guy that is gonna play sonner then be buried in the depth chart

ShooterMcGee's picture

Looks like a solid draft to me with the exception of no TE as mentioned. If it was a full 7 rounds would Easton Stick be a pick at QB? Could he change positions and play slot receiver a la Edelman? Certainly quick enough.

sonomaca's picture

Ted is still there. Is his role to find hidden gems?

D Ernie's picture

His role is to find his marbles which he lost a long time ago

dblbogey's picture

Hey now, he only lost them 2-3 years ago.

Rick F's picture

By the 150 pick they will have 2 offensive lineman. They will have made 7 selections and have depth and good quality players. Gutekunst is a height weight and speed guy like Wolfe was and those threshold are set in stone. This roster has gotten longer and taller with speed to boot. When you have 3 picks inside the top 50 you have a chance to find day 1 contributers. Gutekunst knew he needed a roster flip and to give LaFleur a fighting chance. Credit him for being steady and fixing a under preforming roster.

Ross Uglem's picture

the thresholds are by no means set in stone. Gutekunst's very first draft pick broke the thresholds.

Rick F's picture

He uses all three and try’s to fit players into that mold. Alexander for example had a huge speed number which helped determine his worth. It is hard to compare all three in the evaluations because it is rare to hit all three. The packers use the RAS scoring system which helps create a detailed profile. If you are on Twitter I appreciate your hard work. Thanks again!

Doug Niemczynski's picture

Hockenson at #12. and move up into the 20s ans get Dalton Risner or Noah Fant...Best 2 TE set in the NFL

jannes bjornson's picture

Risner will be there in the second round, but some have him in the third. Has a recent Injury history like Samuels.

Swisch's picture

Doug, while I want to be supportive, aren't you getting greedy with two Iowa tight ends in the first round?
If we choose one, what do you see as the difference between Hock and Fant?

dblbogey's picture

I watched 8-10 Iowa games. IMO, Hock will absolutely be a very good tight end. Great blocker. Fant will possibly be great, or may be a total bust. I'd certainly take Hockenson.

jeremyjjbrown's picture

I feel like maybe you've posted this before...

EdsLaces's picture

Burns and Bush ...SIGN...ME...UP!

jannes bjornson's picture

The Hock and Abram selections would make me happy. Then move to OT in the second if Cajuste is there. Pick number three on Snell the power back . Cover Guard and QB in the fourth Rd. trade up for another four( a f and low 6 ) and get a CB. Six on another TE. Seven on Ingold @ FB.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

Rock ya sin CB 2nd rd or Andy Isabella wr 2nd/3rd

Lphill's picture

Doubt Devin Bush lasts to 30 , in fact Devin White and Devin Bush might go 10 and11 . No way a Devin falls to 30. Draft should go someone named Devin at 12 and The best Tight end at 30 . Could still get a decent edge at 44 .

dblbogey's picture

This is the best time to take BPA, as long as one is a pass rusher and one is an OL in the first 4 picks.

Montana's picture

So I used to hang out in the Packers blog site and after a hiatus, I stumbled upon this site. Great comments here! Since 2010 I have been harping on the lack of defense and have argued with my nephew that the Pack won't make it back to the Superbowl until we have a comparable defense like that 2010 season.

Our numbers from the 2010 season: The defense ranked fifth in yards allowed and finished second in fewest points allowed (240, second best in team history), sacks (47), and interceptions (24), while also limiting quarterbacks to a 67.2 passer rating, first in the league.

With that I would be happy to see the Pack go defense with those two first round picks.
Having a Gronk type TE would be nice but there are no gaurantes in the draft or FA for that matter. Many college players wash out in the NFL so at least FA's have pro stats for comparison. Having taken the Smith's, Amos, and Turner gives the Pack an opportunity to grab the BAP in round one and perhaps beyond. Our defensive backfield needs more help as does the O line and we could use another complimentary running back. I like Gutes FA picks and the new direction the organization seems to be heading.....

Swisch's picture

Welcome to the site from an Idahoan!

Montana's picture

Thanks Swisch.....

Jonathan Spader's picture

Welcome aboard Montana!

Montana's picture

Thanks Jonathan....

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Montana,
Welcome!

Gutey has gone on record that the Pack will not be active next year in FA (in reality they cannot be very active due to the cap). Subsequently, even all of us (me included) throw out names we want drafted I think it imperative the Pack truly drafts BPA for the first 3 or 4 draft selections, particularly in light of the fact the team cannot stray into FA next year to help themselves out. They had better add the best players they possibly can in the first several selections regardless of position.

jeremyjjbrown's picture

They will have 26 million in space if the cap does not go up a lot. If Graham flops they can clear 8 million by cutting him. Obviously, Kenny Clark and Mike Daniels will take up a chunk of that, and if Fackrell get double digit sacks again he will take most of the rest.

Gutey just can't do a 2019 day 2 again next year.

jannes bjornson's picture

Do you give Daniels a third contract or get a DT in thisyear's draft or a high pick next year? I would let Him move on along with Graham and Bulaga as their deals expire.

Montana's picture

Hey thanks Knock...... I'm inclined to agree about the BAP tact although there seems to be some wiggle room about the order of BAP although not a huge disparity.

Our cap for next year looks to be slim given your examples but there is longevity figured in for our recent FA picks and hopefully they all pan out. I have been critical and perhaps too critical of our defense since 2010 and not critical enough of the offense but not due to player attrition alone. Since 2010 I believe a string of factors led to our success in getting to the playoffs but our defense was the biggest key in our early exits and no SB births since 2010.

TE is certainly important and the benefits to Rodgers and the team are undisputable for a good one. I could see Hock or Fant as huge upsides f they fit the BAP scenario but not to give up picks if they are not available. New HC, new coaches lots to be excited about in 2019.......

MarkinMadison's picture

I'm going to be disappointed if the Packers don't address TE until the 5th round. There are at least three guys worth taking in the first 44 picks, and #12 has never had a TE who was both reliable and talented. Time to get one. It will make his final years so much better.

leche's picture

This TE class is still very deep beyond Hockenson and Fant. There should be some solid contributing TEs to be found in the 3rd-4th rounds if we don't get one of the big 2 right away. I'd probably look to one instead of a RB in the 4th though, like above. But without seeing the full draft list it's hard to know for sure

Swisch's picture

Ross and others,
How do we assemble an offensive line that will protect Aaron Rodgers and open up the running game?

lowcsp's picture

With all the quarter backs an defensive players going in the top 10 we could end up with the top lineman in this draft

Montana's picture

Commitment to the run would be a good start......65.8/34.2 run was our ratio last year. The only other team that ran less/passed more was Pittsburgh. Some of our running woes were the o-line, talent at running back, and the 2018 run scheme. I hope Lafleur commits more and brings in a different run philosophy. Rodgers was sacked 49 times last season, fifth most amongst starters......o-line, play selection?
I would agree the o-line needs shoring and is important, just look at Brady's success behind his line. But were we getting all the potential out of our players in 2018......

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Brady also had a hell of a TE and slot receiver allowing him to dump the ball quickly on hot reads. The Packers do not have the TE or slot WR, nor does Rodgers like to dump the ball off.

Who do the Packers draft? An OT high and another OL, along with a TE, and WR? Realistically cannot get all.

Feeling is if LF was creative he would use Adam's in the slot frequently as he would be their most dominating slot WR eliminating need for a draft pick. This would allow St. Brown, MVS, Geronimo, and Moore to evolve and shine. Hope and pray Madison comes back eliminating need for the OL.

Subsequently, the Pack still need a quality OT and ideally a quality TE. Yes, they may put off the TE this year hoping Graham and Tonyan can hold up and fill the bill. Lot of hope there.

At bare minimum they need an OT and I believe a TE without even discussing need for 3rd RB.

Dragon5's picture

Gronk's stats are on the left...my TE pick's stats next to Gronk's, a 1 Life Path and Taurus just like Gronk as well. Stud blocker already, coach up the receiving intangibles (hands / footwork / release / routes etc) and you've got your Pro Bowl TE for the next decade for only a 4th round pick and we currently have two of those. Walter Football has him ranked as the #16 TE...fine by me...who doesn't love a deep discount!?!?

Measurable
Height 6' 6" 6'6"
Weight 258 lbs 253lbs
Arm Length 34¼" 33½"
Hand Size 10¾" 9⅝"
40 Yard Dash 4.68s 4.66s
Vertical Jump 33½" 36½"
Broad Jump 119" 121"
3-Cone Drill 7.18s 7.16s
20 Yard Shuttle 4.47s 4.11s
Bench Press 23 reps 22reps

Montana's picture

I like those numbers......

PeteK's picture

Easy, Hock with #12 and a T like Risner with #30

Dragon5's picture

Foster Moreau TE LSU...a late 3rd likely gets him before OAK's 4th. DAL may try to move up for him as well, especially now that Witten can mentor him on the spot.

lowcsp's picture

if you had hock and burns lined up against each other who would you put your money on I know i wouldn't put it on a under sized pass rusher that can only play on passing downs An dosnt look like he is giving 100% on every play

Swisch's picture

If we could only get one, who would you choose?:
Hock
Burns
Bush
White
Oliver
Fant
Other
From what I'm reading here at Cheesehead TV, these are some favorites with the fans; but it also seems that we may be only able to get one -- at #12, with the others gone by #30.

lowcsp's picture

of that list Oliver he would break a lot of stuff this fall.
But the best offense linemen would also be fine

EdsLaces's picture

White. He is Roquon Smith 2.0 ...and I really wanted Smith.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

I believe I would choose Oliver but he is the most likely on that list to be gone by #12. After that pretty much a toss up between White, Burns, and Fant.

With the strength in the draft on defense front 7 I possible might go Fant to help out the much neglected offense before going heavy on the defensive side for the next 3 or 4 selections. Interesting you did not include Metcalf and even Murray.

Dragon5's picture

White

Desperately need "that field general" 1 life-paths are not only excellent athletes, they are LEADERS

PeteK's picture

Hock because he takes care of 2 facets , blocking and moving the chains. Two things we were poor at last season.

HankScorpio's picture

Speaking of mock drafts, I have a math problem for anyone willing to take it. You are Gute. You are on the clock with pick X and decide it is time to take Jeffrey Simmons. Solve for X.

ShooterMcGee's picture

Pick number 30 would be my X. He had been in top 10 before the injury and we can use him to replace Mike Daniels next year.

Minniman's picture

Hank, I think that it is going to be determined by how the draft falls. Simmons potentially redshirting his first year has to come at some cost.

I'm kind of hoping that there's that run on Edge guys early that leaves the QBs on the board when the Packers pick so that they can trade back 2-4 places, pick up an extra 2nd and still get a reasonable mid R1 BPA pick.

He's a bona fide talent who most likely is a late R1 or early R2 pick. I don't think that he makes it to the #44, so #30 if the Edge guys and TE's are already gone. If not, then either with the acquired early second or trade up in the second and get him.

AgrippaLII's picture

Second round...pick #44.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Hank,
All going to depend who is selected at #12.

If Offense selected at #12 Simmons strongly considered at 30, but preferably try picking up Bush at 30. I think Pack if they bundled their #44 and #76 selection could pick up the injured Simmons within the first 2 or 3 picks in round 2. He will never be there at #44.

Dragon5's picture

00

7 life path already blew his ACL...more injury-riddled seasons likely to come...ditto for 7 life path Devin Bush crowd...we're finally moving on from 7 life path CM3...sure he had a few great seasons, but I'll remember him more for riding the pine and wasting cap space more than Claymaker stamps. In the meantime, we've got 7 life path Kevin King doing the roster damage.

stockholder's picture

Yes to Charles Davis - Making the case for. Wilkins. [email protected] - Top 10 on Boards. replaces Wilkerson. No Guessing. Outstanding Bio: First William V. Campbell Trophy winner in Clemson history … NFF National Scholar-Athlete selection … Nagurski Trophy finalist … Senior CLASS Award finalist … Outland Trophy finalist … Bednarik Award finalist … Lott IMPACT Trophy finalist … Lombardi Award finalist. Love his film. Low pads! @30 Agree but Bush will be gone. Fant to the Vikings Hoek to Cowboys. So Double dip with Simmons instead @30. Next @44 Mack Wilson ILB @75 Ben Bir -Kirven ILB @114 Max Scharping @118 Darnell Savage S

ShooterMcGee's picture

At 6'4" 342 and runs a 5 second 40 Wilkens most definitely could be the pick at 12. There are not too many big men with that type of athleticism. With the 2 Smiths setting the edge all we would need is an ILB that can make tackles behind the line and blitz like Devin Bush. We could have a formidable defense. The later rounds can be used for offense who will primarily provide depth in 2019.

jannes bjornson's picture

He 'e 6'-4" and 315 lbs. You may be confusing his stats for DeMarcus Lawrence the NT. Wilkens is the real deal and many bloggers have been convincing me that his selection would not disappoint. Interior Pass Rush and he could play 5 technique with his quickness.

Dzehren's picture

Charles Davis had a very realistic mock draft. OL & DL.
I referenced it last week.

Old School's picture

I would like to know where y'all think the backup QB ranks from 1-46 over the course of a season.

Starters...1-22. Kicker, punter, a couple of situational guys. Obviously, if your starter is healthy, your backup QB is #46. If your starter gets hurt, he's quite a lot higher.

Seriously. I think our backup QB situation sucks, I think they're surely as important to the team success as a 2nd TE or a 3rd RB or a 4th OLB.

Where do you think the #2 QB fits? #25? #30? #35? Where? And if it's not time to get one when your starter is 36 years old and has been bothered by injuries the last two years, when is it time? When he's dead? Or after we've lost another season because our backup can't play?

jannes bjornson's picture

O.S. I see your smoke signals. I was pushing the #118 or #114 if Grier falls, but I doubt he gets out of the third rd. Stidhem was my choice in Mockery no. 4. He is now moving up some boards. The SEC quarterbacks are facing defenses that send a lot of players to the Pro s.

Skip greenBayless's picture

"I would like to know where y'all think the backup QB ranks from 1-46 over the course of a season."

I think you know where I stand with Boyle and I am glad you think he sucks. It shows that we can disagree and still be respecful. I personally think we found our guy long term in Boyle. I saw enough of him to know he's going to be great. He has all the physical skills to go with the mental toughness and preparation. He's a true professional. Nobody listened to the interview he had with Andy Herman. He filled in the rest of the question marks for me with that interview. The arm strength, the confidence and fearlessness he possesses in the pocket is incredible. A true pocket passer. I think drafting a qb high would be a mistake and death sentence for Boyle and for me. My entire reputation is on the line with this guy and I intend to win it all starting this preseason. The Packers got rid of Hundley last year because of Boyle and they'll get rid of Kizer this year because of Boyle. We're almost at "The Boyleing Point"!! Get ready!!

Dash

Old School's picture

Down votes for asking a question?

dblbogey's picture

It's gotten to be a tough crowd in here.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

I think you did more than ask an innocent question, Old School. Plenty of assertions and insinuations to dislike in your comment, though I did not give you a thumbs down.

The answer in my opinion is when he's dead.

stockholder's picture

SB.Nation's Acme Trolls.

leche's picture

46... And event hat might be too high...

This team is far too concentrated around Rodgers offensively, as it should be... If he gets hurt we're screwed. But at the same time our only real chance at winning a Super Bowl requires both him being healthy and us spending all the available resources we have on providing the best team around him... Spending too much on a QB only to improve a position you hope you don't need is foolish until we're ready to find his actual replacement. But that isn't happening in this draft

Swisch's picture

A rookie quarterback probably isn't going to be able to help in the next couple of years -- so it seems, if we're concerned about the backup to Aaron Rodgers, that we should be looking for a veteran.
I'm actually not giving up on either Kizer or Boyle -- especially in comparison to who we would draft in the later rounds, and maybe even the earlier ones.
Still, the idea of getting a more experienced backup is worth considering, while keeping Kizer or Boyle, as well.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

I know this will generate down votes as it has in the past. If Murray falls to #12 and if Gute has him ranked as BPA I would run the draft card to the podium. He would be an immediate upgrade at back up QB and would be the Pack's future starting QB.

With his athletism I would consider him at minimum a kick off specialist on special teams, as well as try him out as a slot WR (he reminds me of Sproles) all the while backing up Rodgers. Talk about a quick change of direction and twitchy player. If LF was creative I am confidant Murray could fill several roles and immediately contribute all the while being our future starting QB. He does not need to ride the bench if LF is a great coach. Utilize him like NO does with Hill.

Okay...I get it! He isnt the defensive lineman/edge rusher or the OT but you dont get a shot at someone this talented very often. In this scenario I then would try selecting Bush and then either Simmons or an OT.

Oh boy.....here we go!

Be gentle! :)

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

How about this as the question. How many of you would have the fortitude to take QB, Kyler Murray if he fell to #12 with all the needs the Pack currently have? Possibly a generational player. Do you pass him up on chance another player meets expectations?

Come on...what would you do?

leche's picture

I'd construct a bidding war between the Dolphins, Redskins, and Giants to take my #12 pick and trade down...

Trying to shoehorn Murray into a non-QB role just pushes him away to play baseball and the draft pick is wasted. Hill works in NO because he kind of knows he's never going to be the QB anyway. You aren't getting Murray on the field like that to wait another 3+ years. Also isn't worth it for us.

Look for the Packers next QB in 2020 or 2021

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Possible!

However, being an ex athlete myself I always enjoyed a challenge, as well as always wanted to be on the field playing. A player like Murray did not get to where he is at by not being super competitive.

jannes bjornson's picture

Murray is over-rated.

Hematite's picture

No thumbs down here but I wouldn't take him at 12, IMO, he's too small for the pro game.

Minniman's picture

TL;DR - There's too many holes to fill on the roster to make a run with a healthy Rodgers so the backup or heir apparent takes a back seat till next year.

Longer:
While on-paper the Packers have made solid moves this FA it remains to see if these acquisitions are hits or misses (in part as it's unknown how MLF will design the offense - it's a fair call to say that Defense will be Mike Pettine's domain to rule this year, so more of the same from last year). Assuming that they are either hits or serviceable replacements on last year's players the Packers still need to have a lights out Draft this year to reload for another run (with a number of draftees either being day 1 starters or showing strong signs that they could mature into starters by the end of the year).

Were all this to eventuate then next year sees the Packers with more salary cap than this year and hopefully less holes to fill around the team. Early talk on some of the draft specific sites are that next year could see a number of legitimate QB1's in the draft as well as WR's (some are already gagging over the production from freshmen WR's). This could be the year that GB gets creative with player and pick trades and goes after the future of the franchise - or at the very worst could afford a more seasoned veteran QB2. I'm keenly watching what Trevor Lawrence does at Clemson next year, he may be one to spend significant draft capital acquiring in either 2020 or 2021.

Minniman's picture

I also wonder, if the Packers don't have that lights out draft and next year is another disappointment, if Gute doesn't quietly put Rodgers on the trade block. I'm not personally swaying one way or the other, just wondering if there is already a stop-loss point in Gute's mind that triggers the rebuild.

Looking at Baltimore and NYG, unless there's a solid team around the aging QB it's a tough road.

Jonathan Spader's picture

Baltimore had Flacco NGY had Eli neither comes even close to Rodgers.

Since '61's picture

Old School - I agree that our backup QB situation is poor. The question is which assets do we use to address the position. Do we want to use draft capital or cap space.

I’m not sure if there is a college QB this season who is worth utilizing a high draft pick on. If we take a QB in later rounds we really do not improve our situation because we likely end up with another Hundley or Kizer.

If we sign a vet FA we use up vital cap space for a player to sit on the bench.

If Rodgers goes down the season is over anyway. I think our best approach for now is to continue to improve our defense, our OL, RB, TE, and slot WR. Give Rodgers the tools and a better defense. If we can get that accomplished we can look for a QB in next year’s draft as a luxury pick.

For now, let’s see if we have anything in Boyle or if Kizer can figure it out in the new offensive scheme. In 2019 every asset we have needs to be focused on getting it done with Rodgers. He remains our last, best hope. Thanks, Since ‘61

TheKanataThrilla's picture

Lots of rumours of the Cards drafting Kyler Murray. If that were to happen I wouldn't mind packaging Kizer along with a 3rd (or later) round pick for Rosen.

I am not too thrilled with any of these QBs this year other than Murray. Unfortunately with Murray I wonder if he is too small to be an NFL QB. He sure is fun to watch.

CalPacker's picture

Some outside-the-box picks, after we trade down with Washington (#15/#76), Houston (#23/#54) and Oak(#107) : Long (CB)@24; [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]; Jackson (DE)@76; Barton (LB)@107; Knox (TE)@115; Barnes (RB)@119; Nijman (OT)@124 (draft up from 151/186); Powers (OG)@196; Brooks(CB)@228.

In terms of the NFL value chart, these trades convert our 1200 points (#12) into 1390 points (#24+#54+#76+#107)

CalPacker's picture

Typo: of course the trade with Oak would be #24/#107.

Community Guy's picture

i enjoyed the ride.. out-of-the-box picks are the one that make me think.

Packer Dave's picture

I'm on board with getting a devin RD1, but am on the Doug train for using the other pick for a TE. Two guys adding talent to the middle of the field on both sides of the ball.

Also like the idea of taking a late round flyer on Holyfield. I've watched him play a few games last year and would definitely argue that he is a pile mover - like make sure your chinstrap is tight... He would really shine in red zone situations.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

But the Packers cannot afford to carry 4 RB's on the 53. They still need a speedy RB for the offensive scheme to get outside and turn the corner.

Minniman's picture

Fair call re 4 RB's - likewise if GB draft a TE high then they aren't going to keep 4 TE's on the roster.

... but Aaron Jones' 10-yard split is 1.51s - in comparison Ezekiel Elliott's is 1.58s, Saquon Barkley's is 1.54s and Le'Veon Bell's is 1.57s

Sure, these guys are going to run him down over 40, but I'd argue that they aren't going to turn the corner before Jones does....... and Bell will wait till the corner gets made by a couple of road graders (such a patient runner, I'm looking forward to watching him again)!

Buschmen's picture

Definitely agree one of the Devins would elevate our defense and help control opposing running backs.

Tundraboy's picture

I've never ever been this excited about the draft . This is fun.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Me too!

Minniman's picture

Ditto

4thand1's picture

We should look for a Smith or two in the draft.

albert999's picture

Packers make mistakes in FA cap media outlets say
looks like FA could be done and Russ Ball has some explaining to do

Skip greenBayless's picture

Thank you for that bombshell report Uncle Albert. Does this surprise me after what John T. Kirk exposed two days ago? Not anymore. The key to winning long term is a great front office. Right now I have zero confidence in what they are doing. It appears to me and from other sources such as this latest bombshell about their cap, that the Packers front office is in total chaos. I've felt this uneasy since Ted got sick. This just verifies what my gut is telling me. We need changes at the top and fast!!

Dash

porupack's picture

More trash speculation from Dash. No bombshells. Just imaginin a story because he needs to have a target for his languishing id.

We're quite aware Dash, that you have no confidence, or not confident or whatever. Wait, tell us again. How do you like Gute?

albert999's picture

Tom Silverstein has reported the FA errors on acme packing co site
porusack

Skip greenBayless's picture

Ah porupack, I am responding to Uncle Albert's bombshell story that he broke. I am assuming it's true. If it's not than take it up with him. For now I trust Uncle Albert. He's a man of high character and integrity unlike many others here.

Dash

porupack's picture

Its not the story that is the problem. Its your conclusions that the front office is in disarray when there are other explanations implied in the story….which turned out to be a non-story. Its your oft trashing of various packer players, coaches, management with nothing more than speculation and non-football smudge. When you give actual football comments, I can appreciate them comments and sometimes agree. Not tryin to pick a fight, just appreciate when there is more coherent substance behind a critique. The Front Office has made changes, and its worth giving a chance to see the body of evidence and it takes 3-4 years at least. Irregardless that Gute and Ball were in the old regime, people do learn, grow and change strategies, and it is clear some have been initiated.

Since '61's picture

Actually TGR did an excellent job covering the cap situation on another thread on this site earlier today. Basically there is no story. Silverstein’s comment were misinterpreted.

The Packers have $13 million in cap space minus about $5 mil for the draft, leaving us with $8 mil in cap space. Just check the article right here on CHTV for the accurate info.
Thanks, Since ‘61

jannes bjornson's picture

With post-draft cuts potentially occuring theCAP may rise to a higher amount and I'm not convinced Gutekunst is done Dealing for a veteran safety or WR.

albert999's picture

Update: Since initial publishing of this article, Tom Silverstein has reported that the Packers actually have around $13 million in salary cap space at present, not the $5 million he reported on Monday. The discrepancy appears to be due to the team accounting for their draft class and a small amount of cushion for the regular season.

A working theory about this confusion is as follows:

The Packers may be telling agents of players that they have less that $5 million in salary cap space to work with. This would make sense given the previously-expected numbers. If the team has $13 million in cap space as of today, needs to reserve about $5 million to sign draft picks, and wants to reserve $3 million for the regular season, that would leave them with about $5 million in cap money that they feel is usable to sign players before the draft. If the team told this number to an agent, that person could have mentioned it to Silverstein and one of the two parties may have misinterpreted it as the actual current cap space rather than how much the team is willing to work with.

This is just a theory about the genesis of this report, however. See the full article about the original report below.

Skip greenBayless's picture

Thank you for clearing that up Uncle Albert. The damn FAKE NEWS!! It's every where you go now.

Dash

albert999's picture

Yes sir!

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Top as in Murphy, or in Gutey or both?

porupack's picture

Solid picking from Ross. I would agree with others to find 2nd round caliber Olineman capable of starting at RG, and eventual switch to RT. That bothers me more than no TE in top 5rds for this year, if infusion is planned for next year's draft.

Community Guy's picture

Packer Nation apparently not ready to pick another corner; but, the team probably needs another one.

Dragon5's picture

If we trade down, I'm all for it with either 1st rd pick. Byron & Baker are both 1 life paths, excellent athletes / leaders. Jaire is a 1LP too.

TheKanataThrilla's picture

I'd like to take a flyer on Corey Ballentine. Unfortunately his draft stock probably went up quite a bit from the combine. One of those speed guys that Gute likes.

RickInCali's picture

I am also all-in for trading down. Maybe the Raiders are stone in love with someone at 12 and you get their two lower firsts? You could still get the Florida safety or Adderley , a top-tier TE and a potential starting Guard — all before hitting pick 44.

We have a ton of holes and little in the way of quality depth. We desperately need OL help, an ILB, a starting caliber S, a quality corner and a bigger RB. There is still a ton to do and we could sure use more high picks to do it.

Dragon5's picture

4rd Mock on FanSpeak...I'm all about defense rd1...my ideal dream is to panic not catching all defensive snaps on TV this year running to the kitchen / bathroom etc. BUT White & Oliver were gone, so was Taylor...Williams a no-brainer. Highly doubt Butler, despite being raw, slips to 3rd rd. Still would take these results 8 days a week.

YOUR PICKS
R1P12 OT JONAH WILLIAMS ALABAMA
R1P30 CB BYRON MURPHY WASHINGTON
R2P12 EDGE CHASE WINOVICH MICHIGAN
R3P11 WR HAKEEM BUTLER IOWA STATE
R4P12 S AMANI HOOKER IOWA
R4P16 TE FOSTER MOREAU LSU

PS I'm still looking for Cody Ford & Andre Dillard's DOBs if anyone has them. Thanks!

albert999's picture

Pick 12 is the only pick i like on this mock.

Dragon5's picture

it's fine to disagree, but provide a constructive criticism / solution-->why? Not saying you do, but so many fans get all caught up in the media narratives / articles that hype certain players.

albert999's picture

I just disagree except for #12 at this point that’s my opinion and i don’t need to satisfy your wants of my posts.
If anything .....would like to see them trade up to get a potential pro bowler if possible
Thank you

Doug Niemczynski's picture

uh boy

Dragon5's picture

Jets lost out on Barr...they still have $35m in cap space...what if???

Quinnen Williams is there @3, trade 12, 30, and Mike Daniels, who is in the final year of his contract and a Jersey boy to boot...he'd probably embrace the idea of going back home. Jets can get 3 impact players in first round. Jimmy Johnson trade chart means Daniels would be worth 380pts...essentially the 20th pick in the 2nd rd...probably a tad high, but still worth a shot to get draft's bonafide star.

jannes bjornson's picture

What if Williams, a One Year starter blows out his knee incamp and you sit with nobody at the three tech, no depth at O line, no play making TE? If Williams was so damn good why wasn't he the starter last season? Your mock is solid as some have Winovich moving up boards as well as a CB selection would not hurt my feelings. Someone to replace Breeland. After all, it is a Game of replacement. You need the depth.

Dragon5's picture

It's the chance you take for a shot at a superstar. I'm fine with 11 life path Wilkins too be it @12 or further down as a DL value play. We shouldn't be drafting this high again unless Rodgers is hurt or retired. I posted a scenario with OAK if Williams was there at #4 the other day too. I anticipate King to actually have a good year. All the players below are pigs in a pig year...they are likely to outperform...which is why I'd love to sell high on King & Moore if they have great years--I do not trust 7 life paths for the long-term due to their injury proneness. We could draft King's alma matter Byron and have him saddle up next year. Snakes (enemy sign of the pig) Mike Daniels, Taylor Lane, and Bryan Bulaga are major concerns this year as they will likely underperform / be hurt which is why I'd love to peddle Daniels to the Jets and kill two birds with one stone...he'd be a great fit for them professionally and personally given his upbringing there and could have a great community impact.

P SCOTT, JK
DL ADAMS, MONTRAVIUS
S GREENE, RAVEN
LB BURKS, OREN
RB WILLIAMS, JAMAAL
CB WILLIAMS, TRAMON
WR MOORE, J'MON
CB KING, KEVIN
CB BROWN, TONY
DL LOONEY, JAMES
QB RODGERS, AARON
DL COTTON, ERIC
QB KIZER, DESHONE
WR LAZARD, ALLEN
DL CLARK, KENNY
CB JAMERSON, NATRELL

stockholder's picture

Ross- No OL??? Your 2 first picks defense? A DL in the 4th? A Wr in the 3rd? Over TE's before 5? Why?

leche's picture

If I may- The TE prospects might not line up nicely to draft at #44 or #75 which makes grabbing a WR to be our #2 receiving option the best bet... It is my opinion that TE isn't necessarily the Packers' biggest offensive need as much as having a legit #2 receiving option is. I would cite Pittsburgh as a good example of that. Right now we have our version of Brown in Adams, but we don't have a Juju to play off of him anywhere. If it doesn't make sense to reach for a TE early at 12, or reach for Irv Smith at 30 and Smith goes before 44, it might be worth switching directions to a better WR to be a #2 option, addressing TE later in the draft and prioritizing one earlier next year, as necessary

stockholder's picture

It is my opinion that TE isn't necessarily the Packers' biggest offensive need . (I understand and agree). I also understand replacing Cobb in the slot. My suggestion was to put Adams in the slot Also. Instead of drafting a WR Early! But I got a ton of dislikes for going with Defense. And it was refreshing to see that are Free Agents gave us that option. This is a weak draft. To weak to take a DL late. The OL is work. But they stand a better chance of starting down the road. Ross' draft reflected defense which showed his experience.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

I have not looked at the mock drafts since prior to the Combine until today. Holy Hannah have the predictions changed. In particular I looked at Bucky Brooks draft because I think he is pretty knowledgeable. Was shocked he had Fant going to the Pack at #12. Saw other mock drafts with Fant to the Pack. Interesting!

Additionally, Brooks had WR Brown at 30 coming tho the Pack. WOW! Both first rounders to the offense. Guess with FA moves that is what everyone is anticipating. Would imagine an OT would happen in Round 3 (after a defensive selection in round 2) in a scenario like the aforementioned. I have been focused up to this point with the Packers beefing up the DL and edge rusher for the past few months all the while talking about how talented Fant is and how he would change the Packers offense immediately. If the Packers went offense for both round 1 picks and then in either the 2nd or 3rd round picked up an OT I would be okay with that as well.

One very knowledgeable poster a week or two ago talked about cluster picks with a number of picks on either side of the line (defense or offense), and in particular within a position group or two. If the Pack did pick up Fant and Brown at #30 along with a good OT in the top 3 rounds, and a decent running back the Pack would truly be a frightening offense to defense against. Adams and the rest of the ascending WR's with possibly Brown. Throw in Fant with Graham. WOW!

Love all the possible draft scenarios whether focusing on defense or on offense making this time of the year bearable.

stockholder's picture

The problem is none will start! The TE will slow down and get fat. The WR won't get thrown too. And heaven help them if their responsible for a Rodgers INT! Rodgers has chemistry with who he wants. Last year it was so obvious he was missing the wide open man now. Holding onto the ball to long. The WOW is not going to happen. Rodgers window is closing. Defense will help more.

4zone's picture

I only went 3 rounds but came away feeling great.

12: R1P12 EDGE BRIAN BURNS, FLORIDA STATE
30: R1P30 TE T.J. HOCKENSON, IOWA
44: R2P12 WR PARRIS CAMPBELL, OHIO STATE
75: R3P11 RB DEVIN SINGLETARY, FLORIDA ATLANTIC

I had the choice between Fant and Hockenson but chose the better blocker. Lewis would be a great mentor for him to get him up to NFL speed.

I took Campbell over Isabella because of his return experience. We sure could use an upgrade there, not to mention he would be a lethal weapon in our new offense in so many ways.

Lastly I took Singletary for both his production and his pass protection skills. Both make him a great 3rd back that can be a serious 3rd down weapon at the very least.

The theme here was to take a top player at each selection and it fell so that we got depth on the Edge, weapons for AR that are also ready adept at protecting his bacon at the same time. I had to pass on Nasir Adderley which was tough but thought we could always pick someone later and hope for a lucky strike. We aren't hurting as much there as we used to. And I also had to hop over some available OL but we can always load up in Rds 4-7 and hope one or two work out too.

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