Green Bay Packers 2019 NFL Draft: The Reasons Behind the Picks
By DustyEvely
Since the draft began, you all have received a steady stream of content on each pick. You've got the scouting reports, combine numbers and a plethora of other amazing information. I'm here today to talk about the "why" of it all. So let's go through every pick and discuss their fit in Green Bay, why they were selected and what that could mean going forward.
#12: Rashan Gary, DL/OLB, Michigan
When the Packers signed Za'Darius Smith in free agency, many Packers fans were immediately excited about the pass-rushing versatility he could bring to the defense. He's a guy that could potentially line up anywhere on the line. Given the witchcraft Mike Pettine worked with Kyler Fackrell as his #1 pass rushing option last season, the thought of Za'Darius wreacking havoc all over the field is a fun thought.
And then they drafted Gary and cranked up the insanity a notch. Gary is a monster: an athletic freak who stands 6'4", 277 pounds. He's a legitimate threat in the pass rushing game, but can also be a big factor against the run. I can't wait to see what kind of mad scientist stuff Pettine is able to cook up with Gary added to the mix. With Gary, the Packers have added a terrific chess piece to move around and exploit match-ups on defense.
#21: Darnell Savage Jr., S, Maryland
Free Safety was one of the most glaring holes still remaining on the Packers defense going into the draft. I found myself looking at the depth chart and throwing out a lot of hypotheticals. My three main hypotheticals were:
1. Josh Jones improving his coverage skills and taking a major step forward next season.
2. Tramon Williams finding late-career success as an above-average free safety.
3. Adrian Amos playing predominantly free safety while Jones slipped into the strong safety role.
Option 3 seemed to be the best of them, but I don't love the idea of signing a guy in free agency and saying, "Hey, now do this different thing all the time." Not that Amos is incapable of playing free safety, but that shouldn't be his #1 position. With Savage, the Packers get a potentially game-changing free safety to pair with Amos. Savage has good instincts, great coverage skills and is a very good tackler. Adding Savage to pair with Amos gives the Packers a great safety tandem and fills one of their last remaining holes. Both Savage and Amos are versatile pieces, which will allow Pettine more creativity with the back-end of the defense.
#44: Elgton Jenkins, G, Mississippi State
We all saw Aaron Rodgers get pummeled by quick interior pressure repeatedly last season. The signing of Billy Turner helped to shore that up, but the depth along the line didn't look great, and the future is unsure. Jenkins is a guy that could fill in at any spot along the interior offensive line in a pinch this next season. He also is likely the frontrunner for the starting right guard position in 2020, should Billy Turner slide to right tackle after Bryan Bulaga's contract expires.
#75: Jace Sternberger, TE, Texas A&M
With Jimmy Graham, Marcedes Lewis and Robert Tonyan, the tight end position is in pretty good shape for 2019, but it's likely that this will be the last season we see Graham and Lewis in the Green and Gold. That would leave 1 tight end on the roster in 2020, with that one tight end (Tonyan) only being a couple years removed from being a WR converted to TE. Tight end is a position where it usually takes a year or two for the player to become a difference-maker. I doubt we'll see a ton of Sternberger in the offense this year, but don't be shocked to see him used in red zone packages. This first year will likely see him used in spurts as an oversized wide receiver, but this essentially gives him a bit of a redshirt season. When 2020 rolls around, Sternberger should be in a good position to grab the mantle of TE1.
#150: Kingsley Keke, DT, Texas A&M
A strength is a strength until it's not. The Packers interior defensive line looks really good right now. Behind the two obvious stars - Kenny Clark and Mike Daniels - the Packers boast guys like Montravius Adams and Tyler Lancaster. Both Adams and Lancaster are still unproven, but have certainly showed what they're capable of. That's without even mentioning Fadol Brown, who looked pretty good in limited time last season.
But 2019 is Daniels' last year under contract, Kenny Clark is going to need a massive extension within the next couple years, and the combination of Adams/Lancaster/Brown could just as easily bust as break-out.
Keke is pretty raw, but has a pretty impressive skillset. If he can learn for a year behind Clark and Daniels before being pulled into regular duty, he could be a starter and difference-maker in 2020.
#185: Ka'Dar Hollman, CB, Toledo
We're in the 6th round and firmly in the "take a flyer on a guy that could pan out, or not, who knows" territory. Despite spending their first two picks on the cornerback position last year, the Packers still have some question marks in that area. Jaire Alexander looks like a star already. Kevin King looks good when he's on the field, but he can't seem to find a way to stay there. Josh Jackson showed some flashes, but didn't end up with the strongest rookie year (this is where I remind everyone that, traditionally, it takes a year or two for cornerbacks to show who they truly are going to be on the field). After those first three names, the Packers have Tony Brown, Tramon Williams (who will likely be splitting time between cornerback and safety), Natrell Jamerson and Will Redmond. I like Brown and think Williams has a little left in the tank, but that's not a group that allows me to sleep easy at night. Hollman has tremendous speed (4.37 at Toledo's Pro Day) and has impressive athleticism, but there's not much of a chance of him being anything more than a special teamer in his rookie year. If Hollman uses his rookie year as a way to clean up some of his rough edges, there's a chance he turns into some solid depth at the CB position.
#194: Dexter Williams, RB, Notre Dame
Where Hollman was a flyer, Dexter Williams has a chance to contribute from Day 1. The Packers were looking at entering 2019 with a backfield of Aaron Jones, Jamaal Williams, and a handful of other guys battling for a back-up spot. He's a one-cut runner who has a chance to fit really well in LaFleur's zone-blocking scheme. Jones and Jamaal Williams look to still be RB1 and RB2, but Dexter Williams will be lurking just behind that RB2 spot. If Jones or Jamaal Williams has to miss any time, the Packers will still be in good hands with Dexter Williams in the backfield.
#226: Ty Summers, LB, TCU
The linebacking corps of Green Bay has been a talking point for a while. Blake Martinez is a lock and the Packers are hoping for a jump from Oren Burks, but the cupboard is pretty bare after that. I'm sure we'll get quite a bit of Josh Jones in that role, but that's about it. Grabbing an athetic ILB in the 7th round could make for some good depth in that group. It's doubtful Summers will ever turn into anything more than a solid back-up, but there's great value in finding someone like that in the 7th round.
Summers has also shown that he can be a capable pass rusher. Don't be shocked to see him on the edge in pass-rushing downs in preseason. He's a long-shot to make the active roster, but, if he does, his short-term value would likely be on obvious passing downs.
Final thoughts
If there's a theme to this draft, it's "next year." Elgton Jenkins, Jace Sternberger and Kingley Keke are all guys who will likely see spot duty this year, but their real value is short-term depth this year with an eye on jumping into a starting role next season. It may not have been the sexiest draft in the world, but the Packers did a good job at plugging a major hole at safety and providing good depth in some defensive positions, while also bracing themselves for the departure of some players after the 2019 season.
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Dusty Evely is a film analyst for Cheesehead TV. He can be heard talking about the Packers on Pack-A-Day Podcast. He can be found on Twitter at @DustyEvely or email at [email protected].
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Comments (171)
NickPerry
April 29, 2019 at 06:24 am
When I think of a new LB coaching staff and the additions of the Smiths and Gary, I can't help but get that warm fuzzy feeling. It's kinda like the feeling I get when I hear "It Is Time!" With all the new additions plus Clark, Daniels, Keke, and Frackrell the Packers can now send WAVES of pass rushers at opposing offenses while still being able to defend the run... EXCELLENT job Gute.
Savage is the perfect compliment to Amos... Perfect! He can play in the slot, tackle well around the LOS, but mostly the Packers FINALLY have a FS with range for the first time since Nick Collins.
Day 2 Gutekunst absolutely hit it out of the Park. Yes I know I was a HUGE fan of Hockenson but this actually turned out so much better I will come out and say it.. I'm glad we didn't take a TE at #12 and took the first 4 we DID take. Sternberger has a chance to learn from 2 of the best at 2 different things. Graham with his receiving skills and Lewis with his blocking skills. I don't think he could have landed in a better spot. Jenkins was one of my favorite interior O-Line prospects and for the first time in YEARS, I don't have a concern about depth on the O-Line.
Day 3 Gute landed guys who I think can contribute some early like Keke and Williams and 2 others who are very athletic players. Gute has a "Type" and he loaded up with them for the most part these last 2 drafts and in FA.
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 07:14 am
Your thoughts are exactly like mine. I really thought this draft was a home run! Gary was a shock but only because he fell that far. I thought he was a top 5 pick easy and that he would go to Tampa or the Raiders. We as Packer fans will have a blast watching him hit Trubisky, Cousins and Stafford. The NFC North QBs were just out in notice with that pick. The Darnell Savage pick was great! I wanted him at 30 but I wanted him no matter what. He is the next Earl Thomas. Same height, weight, speed and hits like a Mack truck. Jace Sternberger is a STUD! I mean a legit stud who had he played all three years would have been a first round pick. He will be a Zach Ertz/Travis Kelce type player. Watch and see...his tape is wicked!
In 2020 we will lose Bulaga, Graham, Lewis, Tramon Williams and possibly Frackrell and Martinez if Clark’s Deal is not team friendly and Frackrell and Martinez market is too expensive. Taylor Lane could be cut as he will be over 30 and on his last year. So this draft not only addresses most of 2020 changes but also helps set up the 2020 draft.
If we don’t sign too many FA in 2020 which I don't think the cap space will allow us after this years spending spree ....any of the above players hitting FA that get signed by other teams will warrant compensatory picks and if they have good years...those picks can be third or forth rounders if they aren’t traded by season end. I’m liking how Gutey set this off season up.
Handsback
April 29, 2019 at 07:54 am
Zeroluv, OK you wrote something that I think people are afraid of thinking.....that Savage plays like Earl Thomas. I have watched Savage in a couple of games, and he does play like Thomas. I mentioned it before, but with Savage you now have a guy who can play that single high safety position and make that defensive backfield a real no-fly zone.
Green Bay also added three strong oline guys: Turner-RT or RG, Jenkins-LG or C, and Madison-RG or LG. Give the rookies a year, they may start right away, and this team will be hard to stop.
carlos
April 29, 2019 at 08:26 am
Nice to read some positive comments. I agree, it was a good interesting draft for the Packers. I see a ton of upside. I love the new fresh attitude that seems to be the Green Bay Packers. See an aggressive defense in the near future. Could Ty Summers be the sleeper of the draft? Just a gut feeling. Go Pack.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 08:57 am
The knock on Ty is that he lacks the recognition skills to unlock his athleticism in coverage. In some ways that reminds me of Jones in a safety context.
If Summers can prove the pundits wrong, he will be a major steal, but that is probably unlikely, particularly initially. I see Summers as being a viable back up for Martinez (we don’t have an obvious one). Jones is smaller, and will therefore likely have to compete with Burks for the cover backer role.
I really don’t see Jones making the leap to be the primary back up to a coverage safety (I’d love to be wrong). That I think will be Williams, Greene and one of the CBs, maybe Brown.
What makes me excited is that I can’t come up with a final 53 now. There is real competition across both sides of the board.
Even at WR (whom some claim we have inadequate competition) we have Adams, Alison, EQ, MVS, Moore, Kumerow, Lazard plus Davis and Redding. I know nothing of Redding and don’t see Davis as a true receiver prospect, but that still leaves 7 competing (ignoring the possibility of TE use in receiver roles). That is before any UDFA or other roster shuffling, which Gute has undertaken continually in and out of season over the last year, so I expect to continue.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 09:30 am
I think Summers will be a sleeper surprise as a defender and special teams
Kid is a ball hawk and he hits hard as hell
Tundraboy
April 29, 2019 at 08:30 am
And we have coaches that I'm pretty confident we'll use them!
TheBigCheeze
April 29, 2019 at 11:21 am
nick perry....."Sternberger has a chance to learn from 2 of the best at 2 different things.".........I don't know what the hell you were watching last year, but Graham was an absolute BUST!!!!......he got thrown around like a rag doll, by guys 1/2 his size, and had stone hands....and with Lewis.....the jury's still out....McCarthy never played him....so how do we know if he can still block?.....
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 12:48 pm
Graham had one of the best seasons that a TE has ever had in Green Bay. Don't take my word for it....look it up.
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 02:10 pm
Where were the TDs, that's what we got him for. A turn around is possible with the infusion of energy we have around the team this year. this defense will sure give him more chances.
NickPerry
April 30, 2019 at 04:05 am
It doesn't mean Graham & Lewis still doesn't have something they can teach Sternberger...It's called WISDOM.
Both have been in the NFL a long, long time. They may not have met your expectations last season, but they've still had a ton of success in the NFL.
Besides can you REALLY be that critical of how a TE performs in McCarthy's offense?
jeepingmakooi
April 29, 2019 at 06:24 am
I see the defensive guys this year can all play all over the d. Pettines should have a field day with the free agent class and the draft class. I'm excited ntonsee him work his magic
Turophile
April 29, 2019 at 09:49 am
Versatility is a premium priority for Gute, just as much as having a high RAS is.
I think (ie my gut says) the Packers get 3-4 starters/ strong rotational guys from their first four picks plus RB Williams. A very nice draft if that pans out, especially if they can get a little something from the others (like ST work).
When you start thinking about serious needs on the Packers 'D', well there aren't that many now. Maybe an ILB and CB next year. They can put a little more (in terms of early picks) into the offense in 2020, starting with a high pick at OT.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 09:54 am
I don't have as sanguine a view of this draft as many others, so here's my two cents:
I've repeatedly stated that I think some people overvalue pass rushers, and I think Gutekunst is one of those people. We signed two big FA pass rushers and then spent our first pick on one, so I think it's safe to say that Gutekunst thought that was the #1 objective. But we finished 8th in sacks last year without Gary or the Smiths, and I just think we have overemphasized this position. Add in the shoulder issues, and the lack of production issues, and I've have preferred Wilkins at this spot.
The Savage pick is what will make or break this draft. We used 3 picks, including two early 4th rounders, to get this guy. No other safety was taken before our scheduled pick at #30, so I think it's safe to assume that we could either have gotten him, or the #2 safety (whoever we thought that was) with our pick at #30. IMO, trading away three picks to get one guy is a huge gamble. Savage needs to be exceptional, IMO, to justify this selection.
I think the middle of the 2nd round is early to take an interior lineman. I think Jenkins is a solid player, I think we needed a guy with his versatility, but I think that it's just too early to take an interior lineman.
I like the Sternberger pick. I never saw any sense in picking Hock/Fant in the first, but if you want to use a double TE set then you need some TEs. Already, people are complaining about his blocking, but he wasn't drafted for his blocking. He was drafted as a receiver.
Keke, in the 5th , is almost certainly headed for the practice squad.
We started this draft with six picks in the top 118. We got a rotational guy with an injury flag, traded three picks for a safety, and got a #3 TE.
So, you can put me down in the camp that says this wasn't a very good draft for us. I hope I'm wrong, of course, but this is the way it looks to me.
Handsback
April 29, 2019 at 11:28 am
Old School, I think Gary ended up being the BPA at their 12th pick and saw what they could do with him. The fact they got two FA edge guys, enters into the equation...but not that much. We keep hearing take the BPA... well he was the BPA and most people agree with that assessment. You can agree or not with his performance in college, but you need to admit his capabilities are off the chart. It's been awhile since Green Bay has had a player like that. I wrote somewhere that he's the most athletic since Fred Carr.
Savage wasn't going to be available after the Ravens pick. The traded right away which says they wanted him too. Abrams was another Amos so they would have to trade out of the first round to get that FS they needed. I think they saw Savage as the best FS/DB in the draft. Hard to argue since we are just amateurs. The pick of Jenkins tells me they were still going BPA and that they had great confidence in their current crop of WRs.
So I understand your level of skepticism, but watch the camp notes and see if the offensive line starts taking over that line of scrimmage.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 12:25 pm
Savage might be the best safety in the draft. But is he so much better than the second best safety that trading away two early 4th round picks is worth it?
Rashan Gary BPA at #12? That would be a subjective evaluation and I'd like to know why he'd rank higher than Wilkins, for example. Gute's own words were that he had locked onto him in February as the guy he wanted. That would seem to contradict the BPA narrative and support the "this is the guy I have wood for" narrative.
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 12:53 pm
Old School - have you read the summary which Jersey Al posted about Gary yesterday?
As for the 4th round picks, what is the point of having draft capital if you are not going to use it?
Would you rather have 2 fourth picks of questionable value or a premium safety who will likely start and contribute to our defense from day one?
I would rather take Gute’s approach and try to resolve our safety position now rather than TTs approach of allowing it to fester for 2-3 seasons as he did for too many of our position groups. Gute, the Packers, and the league are in a much more aggressive build and win now mode. That’s what professional sports are all about. Would we really be better off with 2 4th round picks that will take 2-3 seasons to develop, maybe, if ever? I’d rather make the most of the 12th and 20th picks. Remember one season after TT drafted Raji and CM3 in the same draft we were playing for and winning the Lombardi trophy. Maybe it happens again. Time will tell, stay positive. Thanks, Since ‘61
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 02:18 pm
SInce61,
Its not a given that 4th rounders are developmental players. There was very good talent there.
But, imagine introducing new GB Packers; Deandre Baker at #30, then trade two fourth rounders into bottom 2nd for one of Rapp, Thornhill or Adderly; or Winovich, KSanders, JFerguson, or JMetcalf, or YCajuste….
or keep two 4ths and have 2 of; Dru Samia, Christian Miller, Amani Oruwariye, Deionte Thompson, or...…
Seems some solid talent in mid rounds and worth using the draft capital differently, to work the mid rounds, not the first round.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 03:26 pm
Of course I read the summary, Since 61. I read everything. And I take everything I read with a grain of salt. I've read glowing reviews on Tony Mandarich, Brent Fullwood, Ahmad Carroll, Jamal Reynolds, Justin Harrell, Derrick Sherrod, and Demarious Randall.
I don't see why the only choices are using 3 picks to move up 9 spots and get one guy or doing nothing for years. In your opinion, how big is the difference between Savage and whoever we could have taken at #30? The answer should be "I don't know", because you don't and neither do I. Gutekunst might think he knows, but as you like to say, time will tell.
Hoping for the best, but do you realize how close we are to making the 2015 draft look fantastic by comparison? Seriously. We're hoping for contributions from three guys....Gary, Savage, and Sternberger. IF anything happens to these guys, it's not a strong draft. And stuff does happen.
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 03:48 pm
Agree totally that I don’t know what will happen and that stuff happens but look at all the 1st round picks we’ve had since 2010 between #25 and # 30, Perry, D.Jones, etc. and others who were marginal players.
It’s about the approach. Take a shot at a player who can help the team today or stay put and take the later picks. Either approach can work or fail. I would rather take my chances with a first round pick then 4th round picks.
Bak is a rare example and was forced into his role prematurely. He has worked hard and has evolved into a great player. On the other hand we took J’mon Moore we in the 4th round last year and he couldn’t get on the field.
And let’s not forget Carl Bradford and Jake Ryan, both 4th rounders who were marginal at best.
Let’s remember that if we do get back to the playoffs we’re not going to see early first round picks again for a while (hopefully) so Gute got himself 2 this year. All we can do now is wait and see. Thanks, Since ‘61
Demon
April 29, 2019 at 04:51 pm
Your arguement with old school is falling on deaf ears 61. He has posted numerous times the only way to go was trade down. The whole more bites at the apple thing.
Most of us were completly worn out on Teds way. Old School and Dash would be thrilled to have the polar bear still.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:30 pm
Since 61....everybody wants a start player. But you have to put an entire team on the field, for sixteen games, and in the playoffs. Do you remember when we were playing some rookie UDFA as our starting OLB in a playoff game? Or when Andre Thurman was starting for us at WR in a playoff game?
You start the season with 53 and a practice squad. You hope that the guys on your practice squad aren't starting by the end of the season, but inevitably, somebody does.
I've always viewed a team as being similar to a chain in that it is only as strong as it's weakest link, and that's why I think that these guys you get in the 4th and 5th round are really important.
Some people, like Demon, are just flat convinced that the strategy that put us in the playoffs 8 straight years is no good. I'd like to see Gutekunst's strategy put us in the playoffs once before I get on the bandwagon.
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 09:53 pm
Old School - No doubt about needing to field an entire team. However, the realities of the salary cap era prevent any team from maintaining 53 NFL quality players on the team.
Gute is trying to get a balanced team of starters and rotational players. At least that is what I think he is trying for based on the moves he has made so far. I agree that 4th and 5th round picks are important. But given the state of the roster Gute inherited he is trying to fill some of the gaping holes, especially on defense with younger and more athletic players. Once had has solidified starting and rotational roles he can look to build the team out at second and third string.
I'm guessing of course but by next year's draft he should be ready to take a different approach than he has so far. What happens in next year's free agency will be a factor as well.
Your final point about Gute's strategy reaching the playoffs is a fair one. Ultimately that will be how he and his draft picks are measured. For now I see more speed and athleticism, especially on our defense. Those traits cannot be coached. Now it is up to the coaches to prepare and the players to learn the schemes and techniques that make the difference on the field.
Phase 1 - Selection, the GMs role. Phase 2 - Preparation, the coach's role.
Phase 3 - Execution, the players job. Each phase is equally important to any team's success, in any field of endeavor.
For the 2019 Packers Phase 1 is mostly completed. Phase 2 begins shortly. Phase 3 in September. Bottom line, it's too soon to tell. But speaking for myself I think we're heading in a good direction. Next point is TC. BTW, I enjoy your posts and our discussions.
Thanks, Since '61
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 09:31 pm
>>I would rather take my chances with a first round pick then 4th round picks.<<
Since61: you aren't recognizing another option:
trade the 2 fourths for bottom of the 2nd round to gain a 4th top 75 player. That is good value.
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 09:45 pm
>>I would rather take my chances with a first round pick then 4th round picks.<<
Since61: you aren't recognizing another option:
trade the 2 fourths for bottom of the 2nd round to gain a 4th top 75 player. That is good value.
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 10:04 pm
Porupack - I understand your point. But we still came away with 4 picks in the first three rounds. We also need to consider that we may not have had a trading partner for the trades you suggest.
Remember Seattle only had 4 picks in this year's draft. That is why they were willing to make the trade with us. They were looking for more picks and we were looking to resolve our safety position. A good trade works for both teams. Amos and Savage have more speed, are more athletic and better tackles than Dix and Burnett. Thanks
Gute has improved the front 7 during FA and with Gary. He has also improved the back end at Safety. Overall our defense is better today than it was at the end of 2018. Thanks, Since '61
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 03:28 pm
2009? Didn't we get Lang in the 4th round that year?
Bear
April 29, 2019 at 04:57 pm
Old School I always enjoy your discussions even though you at times get bullheaded and don’t let facts get in your way. Of course everything is subjective and there are many different viewpoints with more than one being correct.
Many analyst are out there some more accurate than others. I like you research the heck out of players and was surprised by Gary. But, in most projections he was rated the 7th to 11th best player. So yes when you draft 12 he was most likely the BPA. To know why he was ranked above Wilkins I think you need to contact the analysts who rated Wilkins below Gary. In my research most analyst had Gary above Wilkins.
I think Wilkins would have been great for the Packers.......but I feel Gary will also.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:34 pm
Thank you Bear. I hope Gary is great for us. And most of these ratings sites had Gary over Wilkins, but not by a lot. Most of them had Adderley ahead of Savage, too. I think you have to take all that with a grain of salt.
Do I think Gary was a reach at #12? No, not at all. Is he the guy I would have taken there? No. Do I think there's a reasonable chance that he'll be a solid player for us over the next couple ofyears? Yes, I do.
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 12:04 pm
Fully agree with you( school) on Jenkins, solid player but NOT at 44. Gary and especially Savage could be the finishing touch in turning this defensive into something others teams can fear. I'm just praying our Ts stay healthy.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 29, 2019 at 12:12 pm
GB got 4 guys in the top 118, they just happened to get drafted in the top 75. I like Savage a lot. I liked Thornhill a lot too though. And I liked a bunch of guys that went in the 4th and more that went late 3rd who might have been worth a trade up. So, I gave you a rec.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 12:51 pm
We started with 4 picks in the top 75. And two more early in the 4th.
Savage is three picks. IF he's hurt, that's three guys we don't have. If he doesn't play well, that's three picks that aren't playing well. It's a big gamble, IMO. I hope it works, but Gute has done a number of things his first 16 months that have me shaking my head.
blondy45
April 29, 2019 at 02:12 pm
Just asking, Old School. In hindsight, please look at the drafted players in round 4 after pick 113-149. IMO, other than Riley Ridley and or Drue Tranquil, I do not see any names that jump out to me. I still would rather not have either of these two guys as opposed to not having a 3rd round choice. Just my opinion.
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 02:22 pm
But those two fourths could have been used to trade up into 3rd, if not bottom of 2nd. That was where I thought the draft capital wasn't used to the best potential impact. Use it to get another top 75 player. not move in the first, which consumes a lot of capital.
blondy45
April 29, 2019 at 03:02 pm
I do not disagree with you porupack. Again we need to have someone be a trading partner. It did not happen in the first round, who is to say it would happen in the 3rd. It could have happened, there WERE a lot of trades, unfortunately we will never know. Smile, & look to the future, we got a SAVAGE of a player @ pick #21!
blondy45
April 29, 2019 at 03:02 pm
I do not disagree with you porupack. Again we need to have someone be a trading partner. It did not happen in the first round, who is to say it would happen in the 3rd. It could have happened, there WERE a lot of trades, unfortunately we will never know. Smile, & look to the future, we got a SAVAGE of a player @ pick #21!
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 03:14 pm
I’d rather aim high than continue the TT norm if more bodies hoping for a hidden gem. It seems clear that the Packers though Savage was the best safety available and the consensus of what I’ve read seems to support that.
I have no idea how much better he is (we don’t know how good any of the new draftees are in reality), but I like the fact that they chose not to compromise on second best in their assessment.
4th round picks can be great players, but most aren’t. Right now I’m delighted that the roster competition looks good across all positions on O and D. I believe we have more talent than we can keep as it is. Thus marginal upgrades at each position are difference makers. Since FS was perhaps our greatest need, that is also where the marginal upgrade offered the greatest return.
We are so used to numbers over quality and hoping for good not great that it seems it’s difficult to get used to the idea that that approach failed consistently.
blondy45
April 29, 2019 at 03:36 pm
The trade value chart shows the trade between Green Bay & Seattle:
Green Bay #30=620 , #114=66, #118=58 Total=744
Seattle #21=800 We gained 56 points with the trade.
If we stayed at #30 and picked, then we traded both 4th round picks to move up it would equal 124 points. That would make the equal trade be #94, a very late 3rd round pick. There were some good players (Hakeem Butler WR) in this area who would have been worth moving up for sure. Good point porupack, if we found a trading partner.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 03:16 pm
I'm not into names, but there were absolutely some guys available with those two picks that would have been worthwhile additions. I mean, Daniels and Ryan and Aaron Jones were all guys taken in the 4th round or later. Sitton and Lang and Bakhtiari. Didn't we take MVS and ESB in the 4th last year?
I think it is illogical to assume that we couldn't have taken players in the 4th round that would be helpful. I'm questioning how much difference there would be between Savage and the guy we could have taken at #30
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 04:06 pm
OS,
We wont know how players develop and evolve for a minimum of 2+ years and most everyone says three. Subsequently, let's embrace the draft selections and look forward. Is the glass half full or half empty?
Personally, I find the aggressive, take charge and gambling approach Gute has taken to be very uplifting vs the plodding safe approach TT and MM took. It is hard to teach old dogs new tricks and TT and MM were not able to evolve and adapt. Now we have LF and Gute who are bringing new energy and optimism with a new approach. I just hope LF has some Gute in him when it comes to running the 2019 offense.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:37 pm
If I'm thirsty, I don't care if the glass is half full or half empty. Or if the glass is twice as big as it needs to be. I will cheer for these guys and hope for the best.
Thompson's strategy put us in the playoffs 8 straight years. I hope Gutekunst does half as well. Right now, he's 0 for 1.
fastmoving
April 29, 2019 at 03:37 pm
big logic wholes in your story here……..there is no way that the 3 picks all playing well. and ist highly unlikely that all turning out as halfway good Players over the Long run. if one of them would be ok, its a win. so if Savage turns out to be a great Player all its more than perfect.
And if you shake our head over the GM, not that anyone would care, I would see it as a good thing. as the contra indicator you turned out to be more often than not.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:40 pm
If Savage turns out to be a great player, then I'm fine. The odds are against that, of course. I'd rather have three players, hoping that two of them turn out to be contributors.
If Savage is an average starter, then it's probably a loss. If he gets hurt, it would definitely be better to have the three picks.
This is a gamble. I understand that. Some of you seem to think it's automatic that Savage is going to be a great player for us. I don't think that's a sure thing.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2019 at 12:42 am
One truth (not THE truth) is that there was no consensus among pundits and film guys as to which player was the best free safety. I listened to the Pack-a-Day podcast on safeties and those three gentlemen did not agree on the order much, though the same names were on most top 5 lists. So, Gute went up, using two reasonably valuable draft to do so, and got his guy. That's fine: it is his job and responsibility, and I might want to have my people instead of whichever player was left over at #30 or #44. Or I might have them all rated so closely together that it doesn't matter.
Befuddled
April 30, 2019 at 04:52 am
My friend who is a Steelers fan feels the same way. They gave up too much to draft Bush. I reminded him that several mock drafts had him falling right in their lap without trading up.
Packer_Fan
April 29, 2019 at 06:29 am
Good reasoning. Gary and Savage will be expected to produce immediately. Hopefully Jenkins will provide immediate depth. All I know is that one or two of the linemen will get hurt and Jenkins will be playing. Maybe Madison too. There is enough depth in TE, that Sternberger will play some, but won't need to start. Williams the RB will play too. Someone will get hurt and miss some games. The rest, developmental depth. Unless like last year with the CB's, then all hands on deck.
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 06:57 am
I hope Aaron Jones plays all 16 games...he can lead the league in rushing easily.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 11:15 am
I think keeping him healthy for the end of the season by limiting his reps is more important than any rushing title. In the first half of the season, he should be on a "pitch count". This is his third year and he's been hurt the first two. Let's keep him healthy for the stretch run..
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 11:36 am
I know but, can't keep him on a pitch count when playing top teams. It starts early with Da Bears. Williams could help there. He seems to fit the mold of a strong, fast, change of pace runner who dropped in the draft bc of issues.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 12:22 pm
Sure you can. Beating the Bears in Soldier Field is less important than beating them in Lambeau. There's no reason whatsoever for Jones to get more than 15 touches in a game at the beginning of the season.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 03:16 pm
Can’t play Dexter unless he can prove he can block. I agree we shouldn’t be handing off to Jones 30 times a game, but we won’t with Rodgers as our QB. If it’s a question of 15 carries for Jones a game, then that’s fine with me. A weapon unused is no weapon at all.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 03:31 pm
And a weapon who is injured and on the sidelines is not a weapon either. Jones can break big plays, but not if he's broken, and he's had trouble staying healthy. We should be helping him by not letting him get beat up early in the season.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 05:10 pm
Old School, so your argument is that Jones might get injured do we should refrain from using him. I could say the same of Rodgers. Of course that would be rediculous. Ultimately there is no point in having a running back that can flop games unless you use him.
If he doesn’t play he won’t get injured and he won’t flip any fields, well not in our direction at least. If we didn’t need him we shouldn’t play him, so should we trade him for a veteran receiver or maybe someone’s 4th round pick from last weekend ... I could go on but knee jerk contrarianism is just not worth further typing.
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:44 pm
No, that's not my argument. My argument is that running backs take a beating. No other player takes as many hard shots during a game as an RB. The cumulative effect of these wears them down.
I want him to play, and I want him to get the ball. But I want him kept healthy during the season. IF that means giving him a week off, or limiting his pitch count, or whatever, that's what I want.
The Rodgers thing is different. Whereas we can play Williams and still win, we can't win without Rodgers. In fact, last year, we won more games with Williams as the starter than we did with Jones. Fact. Scored more points per game, too.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 10:01 pm
I am actually fine with playing Williams, as long as we drop the alternation with each series and run plays appropriate to the strengths of player on the field.
I think in some circumstances or against certain opponents it makes more sense for Jamaal to get the most carries due to his style being more apt. If they do that, Jones should retain plenty in the tank.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 04:09 pm
Jones just like Eddie Lee Ivory always gets hurt against the Bears (true by the way).
I say sit Jones against the Bears but let him tear it up against other teams.
Tongue in cheek....
TedThomson
April 29, 2019 at 06:32 am
Also don't forget about the picks that weren't made that everybody wanted- i.e. we like our young wide receivers..
4thand10
April 29, 2019 at 06:27 pm
I was hoping there was a way to get Deebo in the mix...watch this year, he is going to be really good.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2019 at 12:46 am
I agree. His route running is so good that I thought even AR might notice him as a rookie. But he went 36th, and I wouldn't advocate for trading up for him.
4thand10
April 30, 2019 at 11:49 pm
Very true.
Cubbygold
April 29, 2019 at 06:53 am
GBs roster is sheding vets and adding youth. Without the need for immediate starters (outside of Savage) I'm glad Gute took the "next year" approach. Its on the coaches now to develop these guys, but the team is positioned well for the next 4 years if these guys can use this redshirt year to their advantage.
Very happy that they didn't draft more WRs. Cutting Yancy and Dupre in the last few years felt like a complete waste of picks. More talent and internal competition is a good thing, but I like that Gute is doing it across the whole roster. Says a lot about the potential they see in these guys. After the offseason reports about how difficult it was or these young recievers to listen to MM and Rodgers, im excited to see them all play on the same page
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 07:00 am
We got three steals last year at WR. All three can play and all three are better than just about any receiver this year. EQ and Kumerow will be 3 and 4 respectively. Kumerow should win the slot and become the next Cobb. He has hands like glue. EQ is tall and if Allison gets hurt again....he will step up like he did last year. Overall no need to draft WRs and Gutey didn’t waste picks doing that this year.
Packers2020
April 29, 2019 at 09:26 am
You realize that they have played one year and St Brown did basically nothing all year, MVS did nothing after defenses adjusted to him, and Moore could not even get on the field. Not to mention they have a HOF QB throwing them the ball which makes them look better than they are. The chances of getting a #1 or #2 WR from a 4th, 5th, or 6th round pick at WR is very low. I have a feeling you are going to be disappointed this year but I hope I am wrong.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 09:32 am
I believe you are wrong
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 10:00 am
In think you will be wrong. MVS and EQ has good years based on being new to the offense. This year they will make the leap. No way they bust. They showed talent and just need some route running refining. Teams didn’t adjust to MVS there was nothing to adjust too. The offense was stagnant and since fat Mike wouldn’t call run plays teams put both safeties on the receivers and took the top off. That won’t happen this year and teams will have to pick their poison. I am willing to bet that Allison has a career year and EQ or MVS do as well. Our receivers weren't the problem...it was fat Mikes play calling that never changed since he took over as HC.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 11:27 am
I scratch my head and wonder why so many seem unable to grasp the fact that rookies generally struggle to put up big numbers at any position. The one exception traditionally has been at RB.
Add into that an injured QB, a complex and predictable and increasingly dysfunctional scheme and MVS’s near 600 yards is not to be sneezed at. EQ has over 300. By way of comparison, Graham had 600 something. If anything last year just showed that Adams is good and that the scheme in Green Bay stunk (something obvious to all who watched).
To write off the rookie recievers from last year based upon their performances as rookies is to misunderstand, or simply not consider, the reality of rookie performance over history. To do so in the dumpster fire of last season makes even less sense.
To put it in a different context, it took Jordy 2 seasons to get a fraction more yards than MVS got last year and significantly more targets. Did Jordy suck? Of course not!
cuervo
April 29, 2019 at 11:54 am
Also, McCarthy's offense was notorious confusing to new recievers because of all the route adjustments, etc. LaFluer's offense will actually scheme people open, rather than depending on them to grasp the playground concepts McCarthy relied on. That will make a huge difference for all of the recievers on this team.
Packers2020
April 29, 2019 at 02:59 pm
Cold,
I am not saying MVS or St Brown suck. I am saying they are not #1 or #2 WR's.
By the way, Jordy was drafted in the 2nd round, I believe. MVS was drafted in the 5th. No comparison there.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 03:21 pm
2019, They were rookies. To achieve their potential they have to play. Jordy is a good example, as is Adams. Both have good hands and elite attributes. Let them play and maybe we will end up with 3 good receivers, each posing a very different threat, even if you write off Alison, Kumerow and co., which I don’t.
Bear
April 29, 2019 at 05:03 pm
That’s just to much logic!
blondy45
April 29, 2019 at 02:20 pm
And Rodgers not practicing with the young WR's! There was no timing without doing it in practice. Rodgers had worked with Adams for years. They were the only two on the same page. Rodgers & his WR's need to learn a new offense. Both parties need reps to succeed.
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 02:26 pm
Well said zeroluv. We got a good corps, and high chance 2 out of the 5 emerging young WRs become big alts opposite DAdams, and overtaking GAllison. Any new WR draftee simply pushes others out the door prematurely.
Packers2020
April 29, 2019 at 02:56 pm
OK, I see your point and I respect it but...
I did not say they would bust, what I am saying is do not expect them to be a #2 WR which is what we are lacking. They are #3 and #4 WR's which is what 4th, 5th, and 6th round picks usually amount to. If Adams gets hurt we are in big trouble. Would you trust any of these other WR's if Adams was not on the field?
CheesyTex
April 29, 2019 at 12:06 pm
2019 "...St Brown did basically nothing all year..."
The St. Brown I watched was sure handed, showed good speed, and BLOCKED like a mother (excuse the term, please).
Plenty of room to grow and improve, but "did basically nothing" just does not fit his performance in my book.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 04:14 pm
Packers2019,
I respectfully believe you are wrong as well. Those 3 young receivers have tons of talent. Check out how Driver, Jones, Adam's, or Jordy did after their first year and explain why you think these young receivers are not going to be significantly improved in year 2?
Otto
April 29, 2019 at 07:01 am
Kingsley Keke -> best name in the draft.
Springer
April 29, 2019 at 11:00 am
What about Sione Takitaki
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 07:08 am
I also want to see what UDFA possibly make the team. The group that was given a try out is very eclectic. I like the QBs that we’re invited for sure....not sure how the rest play out but competition for the practice squad is key as well. If things go wrong....it’s next man up and they better be ready.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 05:12 pm
In addition to the normal UDFA interest there are a few in season pick ups that I will be following. TT generally didn’t replace except when forced, but Gute has consistently added PS/futures types.
The most well known of these is probably former 4th round pick G Nico Siragusa, but there is also the massive if raw former South African youth shot put record holder Gerhard de Beer as a developmental tackle. There is Eric Cotton, a December pick up as a DE who played TE in college as well. Could he be a future blocking TE?
I realize that few developmental prospects morph into starters, but the same is true of UDFAs and even late round draft picks. The difference here is that Gute has quietly added and upgraded prospects on the PS In season and then through futures rather than just standing pat unless injury forced a change. This is a whole source of possible diamonds in the rough that we never had under TT.
It is going to be an interesting off season at the back as well as the front of the roster.
P.S. I forgot Will Redmond (CB). Projected as a first rounder until he tore his ACL, he missed combine and pro day yet was still taken in the 3rd round in 2016 and immediately placed on IR. Waived injured a year later with a related ankle issue, we picked him up in September. Played a special teams snap or two at end of 18. If he can get past his injury, he was considered a first round talent. It is a big if, but still someone worth watching over the off-season.
P.P.S. Well not Siragusa it seems, as he was just waived ...
dobber
April 29, 2019 at 10:18 am
"The most well known of these is probably former 4th round pick G Nico Siragusa, "
I think the battle for positions on the interior OL will be fierce. Certainly Turner appears to be penciled in at RG, but that leaves LG as a spot where I think players will be fighting...and I wouldn't be surprised if a young guy like Siragusa (if he's fully healed from his knee injury) doesn't step in and replace Lane Taylor. McCray and Jenkins can back up all 3 interior line spots and play RT, so they both might make the 53. It might be that Cole Madison is destined for the PS, but his ability to play RT might get him on the roster. They're hurting badly for a guy who can play LT for an extended period if Bakhtiari gets hurt.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 11:30 am
True as to depth at left tackle. I suppose Turner has and could back up there and Spriggs seems better suited to that side. Perhaps all this depth results in Turner being focused more on tackle (unless Spriggs steps up)?
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 12:01 pm
Thanks for replaying the nightmare I had after we didn't pick a T in the second round. The T positions can make or break an offense. Much will ride on the backs of Spriggs and Madison(who played T in a high powered passing attack). Unless we are fortunate and Bulaga stays healthy. A better dream is how sorry I feel for the Ts playing us this year.
Bear
April 29, 2019 at 05:15 pm
Siracusa is gone....released
dobber
April 29, 2019 at 08:18 pm
IN-teresting...
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 09:34 am
I hope the 2 QB’S that we’re invited knock out the 2 that are here now
best 2 win the jobs!
GO PACK
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 10:03 am
If they do I hope Gutey can find trade partners and get any picks for them. Kiser and Boyle should be worth 6th or 7th round picks just based on potential.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 11:34 am
I see no reason to expect a UDFA to out perform the Boyle of Summer 2018. Either Boyle would need to regress badly or we would truly have hit gold dust since he was impressive indeed for a UDFA. That would be wonderful, it’s just that I’m not seeing the reason for the Boyle dislike.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 11:34 am
I agree....we’ll get something i think
Leatherhead
April 29, 2019 at 05:47 pm
I think they should invite me to try out for QB. I'd do at least as well as Kizer, unless until I was broken.
Our backup QB situation is as bad, or worse, as any team in the league. All of our eggs are in the Rodgers basket.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 10:04 pm
I’d be happy to wheel you out there Old School. If you are better than Kizer we might get a pick out of you.
rdent
April 29, 2019 at 08:15 am
Perhaps a bit early to say this but it appears that for 7 years Ted Thompson couldn't fix the problems that Brian Gutekunst has addressed in 2.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 09:35 am
You are correct my friend
I think TT honestly was losing it medically the last years and had become so complacent and cocky/egotistical
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 10:09 am
Ted Thompson Would do Free Agency and that was a BIG issue. Had Gutey not spent in FA we would still be in a mess. There is a balance and Gutey figured out the formula.
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 11:17 am
I think I am more clueless reacting to this post and all the people that agree with it.
RCPackerFan
April 29, 2019 at 08:35 am
Really well write up on the draft class!
My thoughts on the draft class.
#12: Rashan Gary, DL/OLB, Michigan
Exactly like you said about having the Za'Darius Smith they can line him up anywhere. Well to do so they needed a guy who could do some of the same types of things. Enter Gary. Pettine has 2 guys now that can do very similar types of things giving Pettine some serious ability to do many things with the front. On passing downs we could look at a front of The Smiths, Clark or Daniels, Gary. Our pass rush got some serious Juice this offseason.
#21: Darnell Savage Jr., S, Maryland
Last year we saw Pettine really using 3 Safety's a lot. With Whitehead being the 3rd S until he got let go. Don't be surprised if they use 3 S looks again but this time they will have a Savage who can make up a lot of ground with his 4.3 40 speed. My hope is that the 3rd safety will be Josh Jones. I hope he improves and Pettine figures out the best role for him. Regardless having Savage back there, he should be able to make up for some of the mistakes that the CB's may make. We haven't had a S like that since Collins.
#44: Elgton Jenkins, G, Mississippi State
My greatest take away with Jenkins is that, I wonder how warm Taylor's seat is. This OG competition is going to be STRONG. The front runners Taylor, Turner, Jenkins, Madison. Then there are guys behind them that could push for Starting jobs. McCray, Patrick, Siragusa, Light. The competition level is a lot stronger then it has been in years.
#75: Jace Sternberger, TE, Texas A&M
I agree that I don't think we will see Jace dominate this year. I see him as being a guy that is groomed to take over next year. I do think they will find packages to use him in. Maybe redzone. But he is definitely a guy for the future.
#150: Kingsley Keke, DT, Texas A&M
I see him as a backup/rotational player this year. I think he could be a guy that takes over for Daniels next year. For the little that I have seen of him so far, he kind of reminds me of Daniels style of play.
#185: Ka'Dar Hollman, CB, Toledo
This is one of those picks from the Ted Thompson way of thinking. Under Thompson each year he was guaranteed to draft 1 OL, 1 CB, 1 DL. So far Gutekunst is following the same script. Hollman seems like a guy to really root for too. He has some skills. Will be nice to see him play.
#194: Dexter Williams, RB, Notre Dame
I think out of all the rookies, Williams could have as big of an impact as anyone. LaFleur plans to run the ball a lot more, and use the running game to set up the pass. He also uses the outside zone run, which is a perfect fit for Williams. I love Jones. But he has been injured some. And Jamaal is good, but will have to see how he looks in the new scheme. Dexter could be a guy to really watch this year.
#226: Ty Summers, LB, TCU
I wouldn't expect Summers to have much of an impact. But perhaps he comes in and looks good. He at the very least should be able to contribute on special teams if he makes the 53.
I like this draft class overall. I think its reasonable to think that at least 6 of the 8 picks make the 53. I am looking forward to seeing them in preseason.
Spock
April 29, 2019 at 09:13 am
RC, Well thought out analysis of ideas on the picks. I pretty much agree with everything you've written. Well done, sir!
RCPackerFan
April 29, 2019 at 10:19 am
Thanks Spock.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 09:36 am
Interesting. I generally agree. The three safety question I think is more complex, however. I think there are really two versions, one where Safety 3 is a second coverage type and the other where it is a second hybrid ILB cover backer.
I see Jones or Greene in the latter with Burks but not the former, where I think you will see a cb such as Williams or Greene alongside Amos and Savage.
Jones strikes me as likely to see most time as the second ILB in 2 ILB formations. I think that is where he has looked most comfortable and that simplification will help him unlock his athleticism initially and gain confidence.
Some players need less complexity to get over the hump. Jones strikes me as one who suffered from being asked to master multiple roles before he mastered one. Last year we lacked the players to permit such concentration. After FA and the draft, I think that is no longer true.
RCPackerFan
April 29, 2019 at 10:52 am
My hope is that if they do a 3rd safety it will be Jones. He has some really good abilities. He is a more in the box type of player who can be a really effective Blitzer. I hope a 2nd year in this scheme will allow him to use his abilities more, think less and just react. Just a hope.
I agree with you that some players need less complexity. And I agree that Jones is that type of guy. I think if he has mastered the play book and if Pettine has found a role for him that 3rd S role might be designed more around his abilities. Which is essentially would be a ILB/S tweener.
There are some other candidates that might be more inline for the 3rd spot. If the 3 starting CB's are Alexander, Jackson, King then perhaps Williams is that tweener CB/Safety. Another under the radar player could be Natrell Jamerson. Those guys offer the ability to be in coverage.
I could see Pettine having different guys depending on the situations and offensive groupings.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 09:52 am
" I think it's reasonable to think that at least 6 of the 8 picks make the 53."
You're now on the spot. --- Which two won't make the 53?
dobber
April 29, 2019 at 10:12 am
Summers and Hollman end up on the PS.
RCPackerFan
April 29, 2019 at 11:00 am
yeah, that was my thinking.
Not saying they won't make the 53, but they are lower round picks for a reason.
The more I am seeing about Hollman the more I am liking. He could be surprise player for us too.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 11:10 am
Summers on the PS would be most likely, but if Hollman shows his 4.36 speed at CB, he'll be hard to hide on the PS.
Seven out of 8 may make the 53 (barring injuries).
RCPackerFan
April 29, 2019 at 11:40 am
Yeah, I agree about Hollman. He is supposed to be a press corner with 4.36 speed. But ahead of him there are Alexander, Jackson, King, Williams, Brown, Jamerson. He could overtake them, and could be injuries, but I think he has to be really good to make it.
I just think minimum 6 will make it onto the 53 (minus any injuries of course). 7 or all 8 making the 53 are possible as well.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 11:45 am
For once, I believe that it is possible that each pick could legitimately end up on the roster assuming they remain healthy through the off season, resemble their scouting reports and, in the case of Hollman and Summers, contribute on ST (something both can be expected to from their histories and measurables.
It’s a fight for almost every position now, at least outside ST. I would dearly love to add real return competition. Perhaps there is a UDFA or even trialist like Shepherd, who could use that as a route to the roster. That said, this should be a level of competition across the board that will go along way to raising the overall quality of the opening day roster.
zoellner25
April 29, 2019 at 08:42 am
I'm excited for Savage. Been waiting for a FS who actually like to tackle and hit and lead. that last guy was all mouth and no performance.
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 09:31 am
First off congrats to Jersey Al and the CHTV staff for a great job of covering the Packers 2019 draft. All of your hard work showed up throughout the coverage. Well done!
What I like about Gute is that between his FA signings and draft picks he is not allowing weaknesses on the team to fester for years as TT did with Safety, TE, RB, ILB, etc..
Gute has aggressively addressed pass rush, safety, OL, CB, TE, WR, and RB in his first 2 off seasons.
I know ILB lacks depth but the reality is that on many downs in Pettine's defense one of the Smiths and/or Gary will likely be on the field next to Martinez to provide interior pressure. Josh Jones can line up as a hybrid as well. I'm not even sure that there will be a base defense going forward.
As for offense the remaining concern is at backup QB. But using draft capital on a rookie who probably wouldn't be any better than Kizer in his first season is a waste of draft capital. This era of the NFL is about asset management and Gute has got that down pretty well.
If healthy this team should be playoff bound this season.
By 2020, with another draft and FA class watch out NFL!
I can only wonder where this team would be if Gute was made GM 2 or 3 years earlier. What might have been.
Enjoy the ride my fellow Packer fans. Go Pack Go! Thanks, Since '61
Packers2020
April 29, 2019 at 09:30 am
61,
Do not forget about Boyle. He has better pocket presence than Kizer and seems to be a smart guy. He also has a strong arm. I would not be surprised if he makes a jump this year for Kizer to go away and Boyle to be back-up.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 09:50 am
Both Boyle and Kizer strike me as being on a par or better than many of the drafted QBs this year. Some have argued for bringing in a veteran. I see the point, but I think it would do little: I am not convinced that an affordable option would give us much greater a chance to win.
Next year is projected to be a deep and talented QB class, whereas this year was perceived as both shallow and weak beyond perhaps a couple of players (three if you are the Giants). Kizer would, based on what I have read, likely been the first or second off the board this year (except for perhaps in the Giants evaluation).
Given those facts, and our cap position, next year represents a much more obvious opportunity to bring in a player to develop behind Rodgers. In the interim, it gives Kizer and Boyle another year to develop with a deep QB development coaching staff. Should one or both progress we gain in terms of less need or trade capital.
In the event of one regressing, we have UDFAs coming in it seems (Boyle was one himself). Only in the event of both being execrable into training camp would I see bringing in a vet as a real and beneficial possibility.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 09:59 am
Kizer, Boyle, Cornelius & Manny Wilkins. -- The BU QB battle is just starting. -- Preseason will be make or break for all 4 entries.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 11:40 am
Problem like Lafleur said it’s hard to get 4 qb’s back up reps to see who stands out
porupack
April 29, 2019 at 02:37 pm
agreed Coldworld. This 2019 draft should position GB well for 2020 draft regarding future positions to develop.
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 02:24 pm
Excluding Boyle's last preseason game.
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 09:39 am
Boyle and Cornelius
AndrewInAtlanta
April 29, 2019 at 10:03 am
Let me 2nd Since ‘61...great job by Jersey Al and the CHTV team. Well done!
Doug Niemczynski
May 01, 2019 at 06:46 pm
I think MVS and EQ will have a solid 2019 season.
Will J. Kummero be in the slot WR position? Really wanted Isabella. But, I do like Jake.
dobber
April 29, 2019 at 10:03 am
I think you're hitting on the key idea and that's trying to identify where this team may or will be thin in 2019. I think this is one of the great challenge of cap-era football: fielding a deep and complete team. Last season, BG (and the coaching staff) chose to enter the season dangerously thin at OLB as they were counting on Perry and CMIII to stay healthy and backing them up with unproven players (Fackrell and Gilbert). They were weak at S and relying heavily on rookies and aging vets to float the CB position. The OL depth featured a plethora of bodies but a deficiency of players.
As the 2019 roster begins to take shape, the WR position is terribly thin. It's #17 backed up by potential and youth, and while some of the young WR had their moments in 2018, there's a lot of growth that has to happen there, yet. While people were unhappy with Graham last year, it's mostly in the face of his cost (and dropped passes). There's little proven depth behind him in terms of pass-catching. The QB depth problem is a given. Unless Spriggs finds his legs with a new coaching staff and a new scheme (which, actually, favors his strengths), there's no long-term viable backup at LT. I feel better about the RB position as I think Dexter Williams is a better fit for the offense they want to run than Jamaal Williams, and won't require as much of an adjustment if/when AJones gets hurt.
While ILB is a concern on defense, there are a lot of ways to cover for a lack of depth there, although the run D will suffer if Martinez misses significant time. I worry what will happen to this defense if Clark goes down for any length of time. It could be that they can make do with Lancaster (the only other true NT on the roster who will be hard-pressed to make the 53) on run downs and rotational pieces on passing downs, but Clark is a difference maker. With the ability of TWill to shift between FS and CB, the DB position looks well-stocked and solid for the first time in years.
I think the end message here is that a healthy Packers team actually has great potential in 2019. The starters look good, and BG went after the key positions that lack depth and shored them up in FA and the draft. The question is: where will the leaks appear, and will this team be able to stand up to them?
Since'61
April 29, 2019 at 10:45 am
Dobber an excellent post as usual and I agree with your points. WR is an area of concern but with more 2 TE sets we may see just Adams and Allison as the WRs in many plays.
Add in more running plays and the need for 3 or 4 WR sets becomes mitigated. Our offensive doesn’t need to be explosive just consistent enough to stay on the field and move the chains.
I’m not saying we don’t need more behind Adams because we do. I believe next year will be about adding skill players to the offense. This year has been about defense and reinforcing the OL. Gute is trying to develop a balanced team on both sides of the ball. More than anything remaining healthy will be the key for this team. Thanks, Since ‘61
dobber
April 29, 2019 at 11:11 am
I think it won't take long to find out which of the young WR will be able to cut it. I worry that a change in offense and coaching staff will slow down their development a little, but they need these guys to be productive. If it were any other team's draft, I think we'd assert that it's unrealistic to expect that two of three day-3 picks (Moore/ESB/MVS) would turn into quality NFL players, so we need to make sure we're taking a sober look at these guys. I'm hoping one becomes a solid 3 or maybe 2, and another becomes a playable backup...but even then, that's a lot to ask.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 11:56 am
A minor point, but I am hoping that, in addition to the TEs, we bring the RBs truly into the passing game this year.
I would also observe that Alison will be in the WR mix. Adams, Alison, MVS/EQ could easily be a legitimate starting 3 or 4 receiver set with one or more dropping out for a TE or to favor individual strengths. Behind them, we have Moore and Kumerow, Lazard etc.
Look back at prior years. Only the Jennings/Jordy/Driver/Jones line up looks notably stronger in recent years, and that was not actually together as long as one thinks. Moreover there was little behind them.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 08:08 pm
Cold,
Very astute post! See my comments.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 08:08 pm
Since and Dobber,
I think many of Packer fans are going to be very surprised at the success those 3 young WR's and Kumerow are going to have in 2019 with their 2nd year, and the new offensive scheme. Also, do not forget Allison! I do not believe either of you will feel there is a big need for more talent infusion at WR in 2020. WR is the least of my worries heading into 2019.
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 10:13 am
We will t have much money in 2020 after signing Clark and possibly Martinez but the good news is that we should get enough compensatory picks for losing Graham, Bulaga, Tramon Williams, Daniels and maybe Fackrell that it will set up 2021 real well for the draft and leave money to sign a supporting cast to keep our defense in tact.
JohnnyLogan
April 29, 2019 at 10:07 am
I love every pick of this draft... but that doesn't negate the fact that we have a mediocre receiver corps. I've set records I think for thumbs down in other threads so let me try and break the record here. The 3 kids from last year, Allison and Kumerow are just guys. Virtually every team has two or three guys like them. Rodgers set a record last year for throwing balls into the stands for a reason. They will likely improve but there are no stars there and if Adams goes down all that good D that Gute drafted will be for naught. A 2nd round receiver should have been a must. Rodgers will not be as happy as you all think he'll be this year.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 10:20 am
"The 3 kids from last year, Allison and Kumerow are just guys."
Don't call them "just guys". That is still an unknown. The best description would be "unproven".
Personally, I would have liked a 2nd day WR chosen or a FA WR signed also. -- However, Gute may not be done shuffling the WR corp. -- It's still a long ways to September.
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 08:50 pm
Samson,
I agree. Man, they are not top 10 picks, but to think 4th, 5th, 6th round picks are from the scrap heap, I disagree.
Free agents make the Packers most every year. HOW????
So drafted players are, on average, the 8 best players from each state. Not each team, each state. That is a select group of athletes. Maybe not all super elite, but special for sure. And yes, the NFL is tough.
We have athletes that have to learn the system and have the "want to" to play. If they don't, they wont last.
I can only remember 1 Kumerow drop. Allison was on his way to a 1000 yard season. I will take those guys anytime.
Befuddled
April 30, 2019 at 04:19 am
The Saints were one botched call away from the Super bowl with one stud receiver, several "just guys" and no tight end to speak of. They did throw to the backs a lot. Coincidently like the team that just won the Super bowl.
Coldworld
April 30, 2019 at 07:22 am
I am hoping we will start doing that too! It adds a level of complexity for defenders and is ideal where you have a TE reception threat as we do. It was a striking deficiency of MMs scheme even when Monty was starting. Jamaal Williams has shown signs of being a good pass catcher in particular. Use that. Since he can block, let’s look at some 2 back sets with blocking or release options as well as screens.
Doug Niemczynski
May 01, 2019 at 06:48 pm
They have to stay healthy.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 10:11 am
Nice to see that the more info that's unearthed on the draftees, the better this draft appears. -- It's also obvious that Gute's slant is speed, versatility & athleticism. -- Two FAgency periods & 2 drafts, Gute has improved the GB roster considerably.
One more note: Look for a few 53-man roster surprises. Some (formerly) entrenched players will be looking for a new team by the end of TC & preseason games (if not sooner).
PatrickGB
April 29, 2019 at 10:54 am
Samson, I hope that guy is not Daniels. Rumors have already been heard about his departure. But with Gutekunst, one never knows.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 11:05 am
Read the same about Daniels. -- I agree with you. The DL in 2019 will be better with Daniels. -- GB can let him walk as a FA after season 2019.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 12:01 pm
I’d not cut him, but there might come a point where I’d trade. It would have to be a pretty darn good offer though. Never say never, but always ask why?
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 08:13 pm
Patrick and Samson,
Agreed!
There will be fringe vets who lose their jobs. This is going to be a very competitive camp. Plus, the offensive scheme will uncover those who are not suited to it.
Samson, I agree the Packers would be best served to keep Daniel's in 2019 with the exception of the Pack having to cut or expose a talented young DL due to numbers, and/or because the team is offered decent compensation for Daniels.
NJMagic
April 29, 2019 at 10:35 am
Sadly haven't had a chance to comment on this draft, but re:WR thread above. I do not expect last year's picks to ever be "true" #1's (i.e. capable of winning 1:1 on their own) but that is not the model the Pack is pursuing.
They are putting a lot of resources into elevating the REST of the roster and telling Rodgers (and MLF) to earn his 30mil and elevate the WR play. Plus, they have Adams as a true #1 already.
It's the same model Brady plays with year-in, year-out.
I scoffed every time A NFL draft pundit labelled WR a high round need. Particularly, with the years until they "get it." Would have loved a mid-tier, inexpensive FA WR though... But can't have it all.
I love this approach and will hopefully no longer cringe every time we near the end of the game with Aaron on the sidelines (see Rams).
NJMagic
April 29, 2019 at 10:35 am
Sadly haven't had a chance to comment on this draft, but re:WR thread above. I do not expect last year's picks to ever be "true" #1's (i.e. capable of winning 1:1 on their own) but that is not the model the Pack is pursuing.
They are putting a lot of resources into elevating the REST of the roster and telling Rodgers (and MLF) to earn his 30mil and elevate the WR play. Plus, they have Adams as a true #1 already.
It's the same model Brady plays with year-in, year-out.
I scoffed every time A NFL draft pundit labelled WR a high round need. Particularly, with the years until they "get it." Would have loved a mid-tier, inexpensive FA WR though... But can't have it all.
I love this approach and will hopefully no longer cringe every time we near the end of the game with Aaron on the sidelines (see Rams).
cheesehead1
April 29, 2019 at 10:35 am
Hoping that Kumerow gets a real look and Burks can step up his game. As a 3rd round pick he was hardly noticeable last season. Finally, and I know it’s been mentioned many times, but King needs to stay healthy or maybe it will be time to move on after the season. Just hoping he worked his butt off this offseason.
jimtalkbox
April 29, 2019 at 10:37 am
I'm really enthusiastic as to how this offseason is going. Gutey is FINALLY addressing the pass rush in a very substantial way! I'm very excited for 2019 and beyond!
tm_inter
April 29, 2019 at 10:58 am
I disagree with the "next year" theme for this year's draft picks. I think most of them can contribute right away: Gary, Savage, Jenkins, Sternberger, Keke, and Dexter Williams. Even Hollman and Summers may also be rotational players.
Samson
April 29, 2019 at 11:23 am
Agree. -- All eight have been drafted (obviously) for beyond season 2019..... However, they won't all be wandering the sidelines this coming season. --- Savage will start. --- The rest may play a bigger role from day one than many might believe. --- MLF is going to play whoever performs regardless of their rookie status.
croatpackfan
April 29, 2019 at 11:39 am
Dusty, where is the announcement about releasing Dean Lowry. He is still listed on Packers.com as DL with # 94.
Or you have information that Packers do not count on him ny more, or that he is at trade block?
Because, naming Brown, Lancaster and Adams before Lowry, as guys Packers count on, looks like improbable mistake. At least Dean Lowry has several sacks and pressures on his count...
albert999
April 29, 2019 at 11:42 am
NICE JOB ON THE DRAFT AL AND CHTV!
Lphill
April 29, 2019 at 11:42 am
Ty Summers may be starting next to Blake Martinez, he may be the gem of the draft.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 09:01 pm
Lphill,
I am hoping for Ty to surprise and hope you are right but would be pleasantly shocked if that happens in 2019. First goal make team and acclimate to NFL. I too like what I see of him though.
Swisch
April 29, 2019 at 11:48 am
A little Dexterity, a little Savagery; a measure of Rashness, a measure of Sternness. This draft of the Packers may go under the Ka'dar, but that's no Big E. After all, we gained a Kingsley ransom in talent. So Ty a bow around it, and welcome the present of the Green Bay Packers draft class of 2019!!!
All the best to our newest guys.
packergal
April 29, 2019 at 01:21 pm
Swisch,
A very creative post that cleverly references the 2019 Draftees.
Bravo!
Swisch
April 29, 2019 at 02:32 pm
Thank you very much, packergal.
packergal
April 29, 2019 at 01:21 pm
Swisch,
A very creative post that cleverly references the 2019 Draftees.
Bravo!
Thegreatreynoldo
April 29, 2019 at 12:40 pm
Nice article. It does present the ceiling for the four guys taken on day one and two rather than any more temperate descriptions. Then it suddenly veers around the other way on the day three guys for the most part.
I like Keke quite a bit. Dexter Williams might well contribute but he doesn't have a clue on how to block and might get AR killed.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 01:02 pm
Yes, under MM that would pretty much guarantee he would not see the field. Unless he learns fast, I can’t see LaFleur risking him either. Either his blocking is a lot better than advertised or I can see him heading to the PS solely for that reason despite his other strengths.
PeteK
April 29, 2019 at 02:42 pm
I think he'll learn how to block quickly because he has the stout body and a great opportunity. He could be an important player in the offense and won't get too many more chances to prove himself after his past problems.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 03:28 pm
I hope so. That said, keeping Rodgers healthy requires that he has to before he is ready to play.
jeremyjjbrown
April 29, 2019 at 03:06 pm
"Not that Amos is incapable of playing free safety"
Can we please stop with this stuff? He played FS about 60% in 2018 and earned very high remarks doing so. Saying he can't play FS or is inferior at it is totally nonsense.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 03:32 pm
True, I find that irritating too, but in reality, the fact is we didn’t have a safety worthy of starting at the safety position not occupied by Amos. Now we do. Hopefully a combination of Williams and others can provide adequate depth behind them as well
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 05:24 pm
Coldworld,
Neither "Smash" nor Savage were here last year. They both start from scratch. At least "Smash" has NFL experience.
And the rest of the DB's have a year of experience in the D. And Tramon to coach them on the field. So, I assume healthy, young, athletic DB's with a big upside.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 05:19 pm
I’m not sure where we disagree. I was just agreeing that the notion that Amos can’t play FS is a fallacy and then noting that it doesn’t really matter because we need capable starters at both FS and SS and that between the two of them Amos and Savage should be able to deliver that.
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 05:33 pm
Coldworld,
Bad communication on my part I guess. My point (at least to me) is we have a whole new world in the DBs. Besides T. Williams, there is only 1 year of experience, in our system, in a few of our players.
So there is any combination of players to emerge (or fall on their face). We have a lot of young, athletic, fast players who will earn their place.
I guess I hope it is Amos and Savage, but others will have a say.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 29, 2019 at 08:21 pm
Ice,
With our improved front 7 and pass rush those DB's and Safety's dont need a lot of experience! :)
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 08:53 pm
Knock,
You are right, they go hand in hand.
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 10:19 pm
I agree Ice. Amos and Savage will I hope allow time for players like Greene, Brown etc. to develop their natural talents without being forced to start.
While it’s tough for any rookie safety, I have hope that Savage has the ability to read play that will give him an edge. That said, I think it took Collins till his 4th season to click. Some of our QB depth will inevitably blend with safety roles and others overlap at ILB. It will be interesting to watch.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2019 at 01:18 am
I agree with the comments above. I do think it is easier to find an adequate strong safety than a single high free safety. Still thinking we might sign Ibraheim Campbell, who has some familiarity with the system and should provide nice depth at SS.
Coldworld
April 30, 2019 at 07:26 am
I’d be happy to bring Campbell in when fit. I think he would help bolster depth at SS too. If they move Jones to ILB in all but name, Campbell would be particularly helpful.
gary g
April 29, 2019 at 04:20 pm
Thanks to AL and CHTV! You guys do a great job with this site. As a packer fan living in New York i check in on this site every day. Thanks again.
4thand10
April 29, 2019 at 07:00 pm
“Given the witchcraft Mike Pettine worked with Kyler Fackrell as his #1 pass rushing option last season“
This was fricken awesome to read!! I love it.
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 07:30 pm
OK everyone,
It is a very popular topic to say Daniels is gone next year.
Why?? the Pack pays it's people. Yes, he (or teams) can price himself out of our market, but geezes, that's a year away.
But others have left for more money, Daniels would not be the 1st. You do know about supply and demand?
I hope Daniels continues his solid play and earns his contract to stay here. He has been a good Packer.
zeroluv
April 29, 2019 at 07:43 pm
Daniels is 30 years old and will be 31 next year going on an fast 32. He SHOULD NOT be resigned. His production will fall quickly. I would rather let him walk and let another team sign him and get a 3rd or 4th round compensatory pick. Again....he should not be signed!
Coldworld
April 29, 2019 at 10:22 pm
Precisely those points could encourage some players to push for an out and become a distraction. I hope that’s not what is being suggested is happening?
IceBowl
April 29, 2019 at 08:14 pm
zeroluv,
That is to be determined.
Of course he has to earn it. But 31 is not a death trap.
It does seem we are positioned to replace him if he gets better offers.
zeroluv
April 30, 2019 at 06:56 am
IceBowl,
31 isn’t a death trap but most players production falls quickly. Daniels is a solid player and has a great motor and he could probably play a few more years...i love Daniels as a Packer so this isn’t a knock on him. I just don’t like spending money on players on the wrong side of their production years. Also, letting Daniels walk would net us a very high compensatory pick probably in the 3rd round which would be solid and Keke I think could replace his production cheaper. Don’t forget...next year we have to resign Clark and he won’t come cheap and Martinez is due as well. I’d rather sign 2 ascending players than Daniels who is in the wrong side of his career.
Next year with all of our losses in players we will have about 25 million in cap space....after signing Clark and possibly Martinez...we will have just enough to cover the draft picks. We also have Bakhtiari due in 2021 who is the best Tackle in the game and will command a lot of money.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2019 at 08:35 am
I agree with Dusty the strength of the D line is Daniels and Clark and impressive depth making that group the best on the Pack.
But why no love for Lowery, Dusty? Dean must be feeling like Dangerfield...can’t get any respect.
Lowery is the #3 D lineman on the team and it isn’t even close. He was pressuring the QB with eye opening consistency the last half of the season.
Doug Niemczynski
May 01, 2019 at 06:49 pm
Lowry is a solid backup against the run.