Confessions of a Polluted Mindset - Help from the Vikings?

The Weekly Packers Brain Drain from Jersey Al.

Vikings - Did anyone notice that the Vikings drafted two cornerbacks after helping the Packers land Christian Watson? lol.

Rhyan and Tom - Both of these players required a discussion as to where they would be listed in the CHTV Draft Guide - Interior Offensive Line or Offensive Tackle. In both cases, we ultimately decided their best shot at NFL success would be on the inside. Of the two, I think Ryhan will be given a legitimate shot at right tackle and if Yosh turns out to be the better option, Rhyan will be given the chance to unseat Royce Newman at right guard.

Smokescreen - The best part of the weekend for me was Gutey saying with a straight face after the first round that he doesn't feel like he HAS to draft a receiver on Day 2 - and then trading his two 2nd round picks to go get Christian Watson.

Agree to disagree - If anyone has seen the McGinn pieces on GO LONG where he gets quotes from NFL Scouts about draft prospects, the only consistent theme is how inconsistent scouts are on prospects. The same player can be described anywhere from a "future All-Pro" to "will have a tough time sticking on a roster." And these are people PAID to evaluate! For Example, on Quay Walker:

One Scout says, "“I didn’t see much there. All those other guys (at Georgia) go 100 miles an hour. He looks like he’s going about 60. Not a great athlete. Not very physical. Not very productive. He moved around to different spots. They used him (to cover) but I don’t think he’s very good." 

While a different scout says, "I trust this kid. He played inside off the ball. He’s big but he moves like a smaller guy. He’s got good range. He’ll strike you. He’ll be a mike. He’ll be able to match guys athletically in coverage. People didn’t think he’d run as well as he did. It’s hard to find those ones that are that big still and can run like that..."

I'm not sure what that first scout was looking at - maybe he confused him with someone else. (I sure hope so)

It matters - After many people (myself included) spent last week pontificating that who the Packers bring in for pre-draft visits doesn't really indicate much - they go ahead and draft six of those players. Yes, Gutey is the ultimate mind gamer. Just like, after years of ignoring the ILB position early in the draft, he drafts one in the first round when the Packers already have an All-Pro at the position. And then he goes and drafts a couple of "older" prospects, another thing many use to eliminate certain prospects to the Packers. I feel like Gutey secretly enjoys trolling know-it-all fans - not that it enters into his decision-making at all, but when it works out that what he does is completely different from what the vocal fans want/expect, he gets a little giddy inside.

Jigsaw puzzle - Speaking of ILBs, it's well known that Joe Barry's specialty is coaching that position. Under his watch, De'Vondre Campbell went from a street free agent to an All-Pro. When Corey Littleton was with the Rams and Barry was his linebackers coach, Littleton had his two best seasons as a Pro, including All-Pro honors. I've seen some Quay Walker scouting reports that have Corey Littleton as a player comp. The puzzle pieces fit, don't they?

No thanks, we're good - So are the Packers really that in love with their defensive backfield or did the entire draft just not go the way they wanted in terms of cornerbacks and safeties?

__________________________

"Jersey Al" Bracco is the Editor-In-Chief, part owner and wearer of many hats for CheeseheadTV.com and PackersTalk.com. He is also a recovering Mason Crosby truther.  Follow Al on twitter at @JerseyalGBP

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13 points

Comments (124)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
MarkinMadison's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:37 am

My guess is that after they gave up the two 2nds to get Watson (and I'm not criticizing that decision) by the time they got on in the third they needed to go OL and by the time they got on in the 4th there were no S prospects they liked that much. Pure speculation, so blast away, but when you look at positions taken and the needs of this team don't tell me about BPA. And after the cap moves to make the contracts work the last few years, and the draft, don't tell me the Packers are not "all in" whatever the heck that means anyway.

Both descriptions of Quay Walker have truth to them. The one that is closer to the truth is probably the one who asked the coaching staff what it was that they were asking Walker to do. That is my guess.

6 points
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Handsback's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:48 am

MarkinMadison great truth to the scouts answers. Also all the scouts comments are only one sentence….you can bet they both gave positive and negative comments.

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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:48 am

There's a certain amount of vetting that's already done for you when you choose players from top-flite programs and on-field units (offense/defense). You know that just to be on the field, these guys are higher end players. As a comparison, it's rare to fault anyone from choosing OL or defensive players from 'Bama just because of the level of play and results on the field. You trust that those players are just damn good because, you know, it's 'Bama. Last couple years, Clemson cycled into that category and now UGA, too.

The other issue is that you know that guy is always surrounded by high-end talent (as alluded to below), so how they play on the field in college and how they project into your system might not be in line with what draftniks like. UGA had 3 high-end LBs and 3 first-round DLs. I think it takes a lot of film work to make sure which one you want. I'm confident on Wyatt--fingers crossed on Walker.

9 points
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murf7777's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:18 am

One thing I stated pre-draft was expect the unexpected. As you said Al, he threw up a lot of smokescreen and did what wasn’t expected with Quay and trading up right away in the 2nd round. What was expected thou is the drafting of 3 WR’s and OL.

I’m so so about the Quay pick as I wanted an EDGE and there was some really good ones available. I do love Quay’s athleticism and size. He has great agility and he can fly to the ball. I also really like the way he tackles, he wraps up and doesn’t throw his body at a player like many safeties do. Let’s hope he lives up to his #22 pick. I’m excited to see how having two potentially very good ILB changes the D.

4 points
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PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:06 am

As I mentioned in an earlier comment ,15 tkls in two post season games. That answers many questions for me.

3 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:58 pm

Vikings - League office is designing a form letter reminding teams they cannot play defense with 12 men on the field. They’re sending it out to all the other 31 teams not located in Green Bay…

They won’t be able to cover this.

Rhyan & Tom - I love Gutekunst is stacking success at OL. Thinking he’ll continue pounding in picks there yearly with the same acumen.

Smoke - I have yet to watch a single post draft interview. Not one. I can’t wait to dial that one in.

Agree to Disagree - TRUTH! I try my best to not put a whole lot of weight into scouting reports for this very reason.

It matters - LOL. No kidding, Al. I had a feeling his visit lists have been trending into significance. Expected to see more of the invitees drafted than usual. Bam Olaseni? 6-8 336 OT? No. “I’m going to sign someone UDFA tonight who’s bigger! Step back… watch and learn, boys!”

Enter, OT Caleb Jones 6-9 369… My brain kinda melted on that one, and I had to laugh.

Jigsaw - I was immediately reminded of Littleton too, Al. Barry is that advanced an innovator at ILB. We’re so fortunate to have him as our DC - said no one. He deserves more respect, more props. Decades long resume of success there. Innovator. Littleton the new prototype. Kamal Martin was a hopeful fit along those lines… Gutekunst might have gotten it right with Walker. He sure did with Campbell.

No Thanks - I did note Gutekunst failed to add a CB… “Always take a Cornerback.” — Ron Wolf

The Safety position seemed weird this year, with the top of class being lights out. The remainder? Most all looked pretty one dimensional. I actually really like Vernon Scott and Innis Gaines - but that may be besides the point.. I do think Tariq Carpenter was drafted for more than STs. New Safety prototype walking into 1265..??? Tariq’s numbers from GT are better than some might think.

Really great stuff, Al. Again… Have a stellar day, friend.

10 points
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MarkinMadison's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:41 am

People have been quick to write off Carpenter as a safety prospect. I'm not so sure. More tape please.

3 points
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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:58 am

He's a tweener. They could ask him to drop some weight to see if he gets a step back, but I think he'll always be a tweener. Right now, the S room is pretty barren past the starters. I have a feeling that if this team has an Achilles heel right now--a position that they're especially vulnerable to injury--this is it. After last season where Vernon Scott was a healthy scratch many weeks, the question has to be 'why?' Good enough to keep but not good enough to activate or help play STs? Gotta be a lot more to that story.

If I had to bet on a UDFA to make the roster this season, I might bet on Tre Sterling from OKSt simply because the depth and future of the S position is so bleak (and the Packers have a history of keeping UDFA safeties). The Packers will almost have to add someone before week 1, unless they feel they've got CB flexibility into that spot that we're just not seeing.

0 points
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wildbill's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:15 am

Agree but wonder with the CBs the Packers feel they can bring King back cheaply if needed. Also there should be some veteran cuts coming after the draft

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PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:16 am

Diddddd you say King ?

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JerseyAl's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:09 am

Well, LaFleur did say in an interview that he would be in the linebackers room. Of course, that could change.

4 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:19 am

Yup! If he’s going to be a Safety/LB Hybrid, he’s going to find himself in the LB Room, -and - the DB Room.

If you think about it, Ray Wilborn is a carbon copy of Tariq Carpenter. We may have more depth here than some might realize. Joe Barry quietly developing Ray last year? I’m convinced of that being the case.

Wilborn was a super talented UDFA signing a year ago. He checks every single box here, just like Carpenter does.

“No thanks! We’re good,” might be more on point than you originally thought, Al…! LOL

0 points
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PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:19 am

The size and speed to possibly be ST beasts.

3 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:47 am

He was brought on board to be a head-hunter, sp teams ace. He could work behind the LBs as a big SS , but why?

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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:55 pm

Glad you asked, Jannes. I’d like to know your thoughts on…

This is the whole mindset we might need to… trash…? Maybe we’re seeing the advent of something special on D, using less traditional player roles -and- player types.

If we are pursuing LaFleur’s stated intent on D, one look pre snap morphing into something entirely different post snap, wouldn’t we see some less traditional player types enter into the picture?

Have we not just seen that happen?

At least, that’s my take on what we might expect with Barry’s D, and the personnel added specifically to run it over these past two years.

It takes special players to run all that stuff. Big enough, yet, fast enough to be effective in multiple position looks/shifts, assuming a number of different responsibilities.

Idk. Maybe I’ve got this all wrong, but that sure is the way things are looking to me: they are following their originally stated plan, and it’s going to look really different.

Lol. When do we start running through the halls, banging on all the doors… “It’s happening!!!” ??? (Insert The Office gif)

1 points
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jannes bjornson's picture

May 05, 2022 at 05:29 am

As long as Summers moves out of the room.

1 points
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packerbackerjim's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:40 am

Jerry Gray is going to coach up whomever is in the DB room. Fear not.

2 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

May 04, 2022 at 05:24 pm

They have already listed him at LB.

1 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:31 pm

They have him listed as a Safety on Packers.com.

Tariq Carpenter 24 S 6-3 230 23 R Georgia Tech

-1 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

May 05, 2022 at 12:43 am

I'm just going by what LaFluer said. I like hybrid defender as much or more than the next guy but a guy with a 7.5 3-cone is going to hung out to dry in coverage. He'll be much better with everything in front of him.

1 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:27 am

GG, you got me thinking about the movie Rudy. When the janitor looks at Rudy (in this case Caleb Jones) and says, "You're 6' nothin, 360 lbs nothin'..."

Go GG Go!

2 points
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MooPack's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:29 am

"No thanks, we're good - So are the Packers really that in love with their defensive backfield or did the entire draft just not go the way they wanted in terms of cornerbacks and safeties?"

The one guy I wish they would have gotten was Dax Hill. Cine not far behind. Though hard to argue not going with the second best big ugly at DL, Wyatt, that fell further than I thought.

3 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:07 am

yO! Moo!!!

Guess who is bigger, had more TCKLS, PD and same number of INT as Dax Hill?

Pick #228 S Tariq Carpenter 6-4 225

Hats off to Gutekunst on finding VALUE.

2 points
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Johnblood27's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:33 am

c'mon GG - you watch tape.

Dax is a completely different animal than Carpenter and his coverage and movement skills are waaaaay over the top of Carps.

I would prefer Dax over Walker or Wyatt on this roster. Take either away - leave the other and give me Dax and I believe that the GBP are a better team today.

How they all pan out? We shall see...

-2 points
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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:09 am

I think it's clear (and been stated before) that the Packers were all about re-setting the defense with a focus on shoring up the middle, especially in the front 7. That sets up the Wyatt and Walker picks, and those picks set the rest of the draft.

That said, I don't know how this first round shakes out if the Packers take Wyatt at 22.

The Packers don't have a real good CF at S. Amos is a solid jack-of-all-trades, and Savage is up and down. That true CF at S could make a real difference for a team that seems to be realigning to win with defense (or, at least, with balance).

3 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:05 am

They have one NOW, with Tariq Carpenter. This kid is big, fast, has phenomenal ball skills 17 PD, 4 INT, and can both range AND tackle, with 223 at Georgia Tech, 7 TFL. Pick #228.

Problem is that everyone and their brother, for the most part, still consider R7s “throw away” picks… the place where you just pile in your STers. That’s not the case anymore. Especially with a great GM and Personnel Department.

Insane shifts in raw talent have infiltrated the NFL DRAFT process. Big $$$ to be had. Big talent, too, for those who are good at finding it.

0 points
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WestCoastPackerBacker's picture

May 04, 2022 at 11:50 am

It also goes to how deep this draft is b/c of the lost COVID season. A guy like Carpenter may have lasted until late in the draft b/c of the sheer volume of talent that showed up in this draft.

2 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:55 pm

Gutekunst did reference that in his presser, WCPB. The covid year affected a lot of players, and he and his staff followed all the players they had scouted previously after transferring around the country. Good point.

“Older players,” a term often tossed around to negate players didn’t phase him one bit either. He just looked at their best years are right in front of them.

-1 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:37 am

I do watch tape, and, we already have that same guy in Savage.

I’m telling you, I think the Packers are looking to transform the Safety position prototypes in their D. I think they are going the Kam Chancellor-type route here as an inclusion to their room with the Carpenter pick. Can’t argue Carpenters stats, which are better than Hill’s.

At 6-3 230 Carpenter runs a 4.52. That’s pretty fast for a player that size. His Pro Day Broad Jump was 11’ 4” which would have tied the top Combine mark for Safeties. Carpenter is a fast, explosive player with size and range. Great in coverage with 17 PD and 4 INT. Great in run stop too with 223 TCKLS, 7 TFL. His red zone coverage is amazing. Georgia Tech pretty much had him patrol the back line of the end zone to swat away.

That melding of positions? “Illusion of Complexity,” thing? LaFleur said he wanted that same element added to his defense at the time of the Joe Barry hire. Don’t sleep on this…

Not to be cutting, but, I’d encourage people to really open their eyes to what Gutekunst is adding as a whole since Joe Barry was hired. The Packers have made an enormous shift on D to become BIGGER, FASTER, MORE EFFECTIVE. Stokes. Slaton. Walker. Ford. Carpenter!

If TJ Slaton had the same number of snaps as Christian Barmore, he would have blown Baremore’s numbers out of the water. I foresee that same kind of production coming with the Jonathan Ford pick at NT (a virtual Slaton clone), and I see big production opportunities unfolding on our D for Carpenter at S.

We’ll see soon enough.

Maybe he was just an ST influenced addition, but, I’m thinking not.

1 points
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murf7777's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:33 am

GG….6’4 is a bit tall for a DB. As Dobber stated he is a bit of a tweener. His 3 cone is 7.5 which isn’t good for a safety. I didn’t review his tape so have no opinion on the eye test. I’d be concerned about his agility, hip flex, etc…. I see him on ST’s and some ILB role if he makes the team.

3 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:51 am

EXACTLY!!! YES!!! HE’S A TWEENER!!!

LaFleur said he wanted that same “Illusion of Complexity” added to his defense upon the hire of Joe Barry.

How else do you pull that off without positional versatility? Safeties that are capable of instantly switching to LB? ILBs instantly capable of switching to EDGE? CB switching to S…? EDGE switching to 3-Tech..? Look at the multi positional offerings of EVERY draft pick on D.

Just sayin’… be ready for it. If Tariq can eventually start pulling off some Kam Chancellor stuff? LOOK OUT!

How big was Kam Chancellor? 6-3 231. Pretty much the exact same size. How fast was Kam Chancellor? 4.69. Tariq Carpenter ran a freaking 4.52!!! BOTH PLAYERS HEAVY HITTERS, but Carpenter has FAR better coverage skills. Carpenter’s college stats at GT were better than Kam Chancellor’s too. Better than Dax Hill’s… Tariq might prove to be more STEAL than ST filler….

I’m thinking from a Personnel standpoint, that 2013 Seattle D might be Joe Barry’s model in the secondary, and that Gutekunst is happy to oblige.

We know Gutekunst was infatuated with that in his contributions to drafting Kevin King, and in Eric Stokes becoming King’s replacement. Just something to think about.

We’re now 2 years into a building process for Joe Barry’s D. I honestly think that’s what we’re seeing here. Throw our old comfortable norms out the window. They weren’t working anyway… Seems the Packers are very focused on building a Championship caliber Defense. It doesn’t come without change.

1 points
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murf7777's picture

May 04, 2022 at 02:41 pm

Come on GG…comparing size doesn’t mean there going to be like him. Cam was a special player. Thinking a 7th rounder is going to replicate that is dreaming. Heavy odds against that happening. We’re you also in the summers bandwagon in 2019?

1 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:13 pm

I was, but, had no idea TO THAT POINT how limiting his 31” arms would be. WHIFF!

And, give me a break with that garbage - “comparing size doesn’t equate” BS. You think I don’t know that? Kam Chancellor is a player-type at Safety that I’ve been wanting to see on the Packers ever since.

You have to admit that 2013 Seattle D was an insanely dynamic and unique set up from a pure personnel standpoint. We know Gutekunst tried to emulate that somewhat with his crush on King.

Is it impossible to imagine these conversations haven’t been had around 1265? With LaFleur? With Barry? When they were discussing what kind of defense they wanted under LaFleur?

Again, sorry if it’s too much conceptualization. That’s the way I’m wired.

0 points
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murf7777's picture

May 05, 2022 at 07:19 am

GG….I like the concepts, just I can’t and don’t expect a 7th rounder regardless of his measurable to be like an All-Pro. Doesn’t mean it can’t happen, just like you might win the lottery someday.

0 points
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greengold's picture

May 05, 2022 at 09:42 am

I’m not expecting it, murf. Nowhere did I say any of that. Nowhere.

Merely ,calling out some unusual characteristics, similarities and possibilities. Trying to surmise their intent.

0 points
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LambeauPlain's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:40 pm

I view Carpenter as a ST player to replace Burks, the 3rd round bust who hung onto the roster by his fingernails due to his average play on STs.

If the 7th rounder can play defense even a little better than Burks, great. I do not view him as a first rounder who somehow, some way plummeted to the 7th.

2 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:19 pm

What gives? Are you seriously projecting that onto me?

That’s BS.

Excuse the F outta me for watching his film, looking up his stuff and sharing info/thoughts.

-1 points
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NickPerry's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:32 am

Personally I can't remember a draft where I did as much homework on players coming out and possible future Packers. It IS funny how scouts, draftniks, or anyone with a podcast or a place to voice their opinions like CHTV differ in observations of players. BUT, after this past weekend it seems most of these folks love what the Packers did. Yippie!!

The reason I like the Quay Walker pick other than the kid is a BEAST and IMO a much better Pro than college player is because of Joe Barry. You CAN'T dispute Barrys past success with ILB'ers in several differnt stops as a coach in the NFL. I think for the first time in a long time, the Defense will be the thing talked about on the 2022 Packers, not the offense. Don't get me wrong, the offense will be just fine, but the defense will determine how far they can go.

The O-Line... Hard to get stocked about O-Line picks but I love what Gutey did. Rhyan and Tom are both solid picks and Walker could be an absolute steal. Once Bakhtiari and Jenkins is back, the Packers have a solid o-line with excellent depth. Hell, I kinda feel sorry for Newman because I think he just got pushed way down the depth chart...GO PACK GO!!!

9 points
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MarkinMadison's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:46 am

I trust GB to pick OL more than any other position. The front office has pulled so many day 1 starters out of day 3 of the draft that it is just sick. And the ability of the coaching staff to put out a competent front while going 9 deep on the depth chart last year was unreal. The only head scratcher was at LT in the playoffs... Newman's fate was decided by Newman with what he did (or didn't do) from February to May. I'm not writing him off yet.

2 points
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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:04 am

We'll see what Newman shows up for camps and in July. I'll be curious to see if he's added some core strength this off-season and if he's ready for the competition that's coming.

2 points
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LLCHESTY's picture

May 04, 2022 at 05:27 pm

He killed it last preseason. If he can pick up on the stunts and blitzes quicker he'll be alright.

1 points
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SnakePigskin's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:47 pm

The D did very well against SF, it was the O that struggled and the STs that wreaked. What was problem with the O? Stud TE was missing and some other stuff that I think is fixed - which is fixes inside heads (sidelines) and also enough of what was needed on the field. Now the D may be even better, so that’s great, and the STs have nowhere to go but up, however, it’s the issues with the O that needed to be fixed more than the D, and I think they will be.

0 points
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Since'61's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:34 am

Hi Al - first congratulations and appreciation to you and the CHTV team for all of your excellent hard work on the CHTV 2022 Draft guide and all of the great articles throughout the NFL draft period. Another job well done.

To me scouts and the alleged draft pundits are always all over the place when it comes to evaluating players for the draft. For the scouts I think it's a matter. of what they are looking for/expecting from players and for the pundits I'm sure it's just a matter of TV ratings and click bait.

I'm confident Rhyan will be starter for the Packers either by the end of this season or by next season. Tom will provide depth and possibly evolve into a starter at some point.

I would not be surprised if Gute and all GMs play some mind games with reporters and fans during the draft process and beyond.

If Barry can turn Walker into an AA-Pro we will be sitting pretty at ILB. GPG!

Thanks, Since '61

8 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:23 am

I second ALL OF THIS. Cheers, Bud!

1 points
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Since'61's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:57 am

Cheers back at ‘ya gg. Thanks, Since ‘61

1 points
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JerseyAl's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:11 am

I appreciate the kind words. Thank you!

3 points
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Since'61's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:58 am

Well deserved Al. Thanks, Since ‘61

2 points
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Rarescope's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:43 am

+1 Al, your articles are always my favs here.

1 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:40 am

Trust me, we needed a Walker. Hell, look at how old #12 is getting! :)

8 points
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:22 am

Style points awarded.

2 points
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Rarescope's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:44 am

With Lewis still on the team hopefully we can pick up another Walker in free agency. ZING!!

All due respect to Big Dawg, love to see him get a few TDs this year :)

1 points
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EddieLeeIvory's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:44 am

Great work from Jersey Al like always.

Is anyone worried about Bakhtiari & Elgton?
Their ACL injuries devastated us. Bakh missed both playoffs when we had the 1 seed & it may have cost us 2 Super Bowls.

5 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:48 am

Definitely concerned with Bakh. At some point, a decision will be made. I wouldn't put all my chips in the center of the poker table regarding Bakh but I have no insider current info on that front. I agree, his absence was a big factor in the loses...among some other unfortunate comings...

0 points
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MainePackFan's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:04 am

The Packers may be concerned as well, based on the number of new additions to the oline. They could be hedging their bets.

2 points
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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:36 am

I think if the Packers were really concerned about his ability to come back and be effective, we'd have seen a true LT taken early. I don't see either of Rhyan or Tom as being NFL LTs at this stage...they might prove me wrong: certainly Bakhtiari did years ago. I think Walker#2 spends a year on the PS and becomes the swing OT in 2023.

3 points
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Rarescope's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:49 am

I'm worried about Bak and Jenkins only in so far as they gave us a lesson in s*** happening - guess what? It happens. And yes, the last two playoff losses should go down as one of the great "if only player x hadn't been injured" stories in all of the NFL. And Bak's was a practice injury too!

Thankfully I enjoy the season for what it is, not how it ends, but it still hurts. Keep those cupboards stocked Gutey, we just might need some of those jars on the shelf.

2 points
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 06:58 am

I respect the Gutester and the Viking lad that agreed to the deal in the 2nd for the Pack to get a big time WR. They both know the stakes are higher and far more glaring when doing this deal within their division. However it plays out, I do respect them for giving it a go. You can't be afraid to LEAN into the SUPERBOWL! Hell, thinking of legally changing my first name to Eileen...

Go, go, go.....

2 points
2
0
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:30 am

C'Mon...

1 points
1
0
Rarescope's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:51 am

And thank you for getting one of the most annoying songs ever written stuck in my head. Back in the day I worked with a line cook that played crap like that during every shift. It was literally (better) music to my ears after he quit.

1 points
1
0
Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:22 pm

I prefer that snappy little tune "I Touch Myself" by the Divinyls. :)

0 points
0
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:36 pm

Lately, I have been wearing out the grooves on the track "Because I Got High" by Afroman....

Go, go, goooo....stay....stay.... horizontal on the couch.......zzzZZZZZZZZZZZ........

*I was going to be more proactive creating various mock drafts this year, UNTIL I Got high.....

1 points
1
0
greengold's picture

May 05, 2022 at 09:55 am

underrated.

0 points
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0
Handsback's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:01 am

Rhyan was a head scratcher to me. On paper his size says OT, his performance says one of the best pass blockers in draft and all Pac12. So why not a higher rating? Some had him 3-5 round OT and should be guard. Packers got him in late 3rd…I think he’s another steal for them for the Oline.

6 points
6
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:42 am

Therein lies the problem with straight RAS. Rhyan may test better for RAS at OG, but, his success rates playing OT cannot be denied.

As a 3 year starter at LT, Sean Rhyan produced a 79% success rate as a pass blocker with a 98.3 pass blocking efficiency mark per PFF, and his 88% success rate as a run blocker makes him possibly the strongest, most powerful run blocker in the entire OT draft class. Those numbers don’t lie. This guy can play.

Gave up just 1 sack last season, 2 sacks in his 3 years starting. As an ASCENDING TALENT, he was the epitome of this in the OT class. He just kept getting better and better. A true MAULER who left Thibodeaux STONED as a pass blocker. Phenomenal add.

He’ll be fine wherever they decide to line him up.

4 points
5
1
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:41 am

I think many draftniks got hung up on the fact that his "arms are short" for an OT, and he doesn't have prototypical H/W numbers. I think a lot of draftniks are "summarizers": people who don't do much investigation on their own, but summarize other peoples' evaluations. Anyone who sits in regular meetings knows this type: they don't add anything to the conversation that's new information or original thought, they just try to stay relevant by summarizing what others have said and claiming it as theirs....then I go back to my office and read CHTV (whoops...outed myself).

Go watch his film. Rhyan is a battler and, for an OT, does a great job of being physical in the run game. The pedigree, dimensions and demeanor hearken back to Josh Sitton. I've said before, the right side of the line is wide open until 64 comes back, and I think it's a two-man race at RG (Newman and Rhyan) and potentially a 3-man race at RT (Nijman, Rhyan, Newman).

5 points
5
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greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:57 am

EXACTLY. As the Violent Femmes said, you gotta “ADD IT UP!”

Rhyan has 11 5/8” hands? That does factor into “length,” FFS. I don’t recall seeing anyone with hands that big, in years of draft study…

Speaking of, I had the pleasure of meeting Ted Thompson and talking with him for a while shortly after one of his drafts… maybe a decade ago. His hands were freaking meat hooks!!! Ho-ly crap!!! We shook hands and I was like “W. T. F..!!!” Not a question either. That was my thought bubble.

Really great guy. “The Ghost,” wearing an all white running suit, no less, standing outside the Pfister Hotel. I’ll never forget that.

I think Nijman starts. His journey, an insanely cool success story. I think he and Bak, Rodgers, the whole gang have become really close. But, Rhyan merely adds insane depth at both OG/OT. Look at Gutekunst go, adding truly multi positional talents now with his every OL pick. Super smart.

The OL room just continues to get bigger, better.

-1 points
1
2
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:38 am

"Rhyan has 11 5/8” hands? That does factor into “length,” FFS. I don’t recall seeing anyone with hands that big, in years of draft study…"

Big hands, I know you're the one...
---Violent Femmes, Blister in the Sun

2 points
2
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:11 am

Hahahaha!!! OMG. Today’s a good day. Thanks for the yuks, dobs!!!

…But, the day, after to-oo-day???

0 points
1
1
MarkinMadison's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:54 am

The only real knock I have seen on him is arm length, and there have been plenty of guys who have defied the ideal there. I don't know what is not to like with the guy. It is rare to see someone who is built so thick who is still so agile. He moves to the second level and downfield with ease. Strong enough to bully a DT. Quick enough to control the edge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEi3NAILP_s

2 points
2
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:24 am

Yeah, Mark, I’m right with you there.

Not only does Sean Rhyan have the strength to control the edge, he has the strength to collapse the entire side of the line. That’s not a joke.

I think he’s really going to challenge Yosh to be our starting RT this year. Or, they may just want to give Yosh full-time backup swing status…

Regardless, very exciting additions there, with proficient OT capabilities in Rhyan & Tom. Packers got crazy value with both picks. Not to mention, the 6-6 320 OT Rasheed Walker, Pick #249, who made Athlons, Ourlads & TSN’s Top 100 Players Rankings.

DANG! I freaking LOVE IT! — ALL OF THEM from Blue Chip programs.

1 points
2
1
LambeauPlain's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:01 pm

A few weeks ago you were automatically discarding OL prospects with short arms, weren't you, G&G?

I maintain the Packers draft team has consistently looked at on field college production, versatility and RAS. Rhyan is a prototypical Packer OL prospect. So is Tom. Arm length has always been subservient to the Packers other three OL values IMO.

I recall many fans bemoaning Bulaga as a "T Rex" short armed first rounder. He did rather well in his NFL career, even with the injury roadblocks.

0 points
0
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 05:19 pm

LP, Nobody said anything about the Ramones…

BEAT ON THE BRAT. BEAT ON THE BRAT. BEAT ON THE BRAT…!!!

LOL.

Yes, I generally, as a rule, look for LENGTH with OTs, OGs, EDGE, LBs, Safeties and CBs. Most of the time*** 34” arms are that magic sweet spot you want for leverage purposes.

Sean Rhyan is another animal entirely.

I’ve also gone on at length, pardon the pun, that there are outliers here at OT. Jason Peters is one player (arms 33 1/8” hands 9 1/4”) , another is Brian Bulaga (arms 33 1/4” hands 9 1/8”).

At OG, TJ Lang did very well with 32.0” arms. Same with Josh Sitton, 32.0” arms. Both All-Pro Guards.

Average arm length for OTs at the NFL Combine, since they started measuring is 34 1/8”.

There have been 19 1st or 2nd Team All Pro OTs since the arm measurements were recorded at the Combine. Not one of them had arms shorter than 33”.

There was much controversy about the Bears top choice two years ago, OT Teven Jenkins arm length actually being 32 7/8” long.

Sean Rhyan’s arm length is 32 5/8”… Damn right it was a concern of mine, until I realized his hands measure 11 5/8”… that’s an unreal measurement at the position. Rhyan’s hand length will be a big determining factor on his ability to stay at LT, or to play RT, because the guy is a complete mauler with them. Exceptional grip strength, and strong, heavy in turning away counter moves. Couple that with a super strong base, light feet, and an insane ability to MIRROR?

I believe that hand use he’s able to employ alone already makes him an outlier just walking through the door, for an OT. I don’t think there’s another in this OT class who can compare.

Cross 10 3/4”. Ekwonu 10 1/4”. Faalele 11” (and he’s 6-8!). Neal 10 1/8”.

Teven Jenkins’ hands by comparison? 9 1/2”.

Every OT taken ahead of Rhyan had at least 34” arms, with the exception Petit-Frere 33 5/8”.

As I mentioned, there are outliers. We’ll see.

FYI:
Zach Tom: arms 33 1/4” hands 10 3/8”.

Rasheed Walker: arms 33 5/8” hands 10 5/8”.

0 points
1
1
MarkinMadison's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:55 pm

Justis over at APC posted an article/series of tweets showing each of the Packers' picks against top edge rushers from this year's draft. I have to say, Rhyan and Tom both looked pretty good. Well worth a look.

0 points
1
1
LLCHESTY's picture

May 04, 2022 at 05:37 pm

His SS was actually slower than the Packers usually like but his 3-cone was well under their normal cutoff for OL. Only had 21 reps on the bench which is pretty low, might need to stop hogging the squat rack and work on some upper body strength, which is funny because looks like Tom is the exact opposite.

-1 points
0
1
Straya's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:49 pm

I'm not certain of Ryan's heritage, but I do note that he's a rugby player and that the NZ All Blacks have built decades of dominance on thickly built pacific islanders who move like sprinters. GB could do with some of that

1 points
1
0
PhantomII's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:57 pm

Not crazy about Newman......looks like he missed the gym....a lot. No real muscle tone. Hope he hit the weights like he wanted to be an NFL OL.

1 points
1
0
Guam's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:50 am

The Packers have a long history (Colledge, Lang, Sitton, Runyon, Newman to name a few) of drafting college tackles and turning them into guards. They also draft college centers (Linsley, Jenkins, Myers, Hanson, Tom) but rarely seem to draft actual college guards. I think they want more athleticism than the average college guard gives them.

Assuming Bahk and Jenkins recover, the Packers look pretty set at tackle with Bahk, Jenkins, Nijman and Van Lanen. They look thin at IOL with Runyon, Myers, Newman, and Hanson. I think Rhyan and Tom are both slated for IOL.

The sleeper pick is the seventh round OT from Penn State. Some experts thought this kid could be a first or second round pick after his junior season, but he inexplicably had a very average senior year and fell. It will be interesting to see what our O-line coaches can do with him.

1 points
2
1
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:43 am

Successful OTs and Cs tend to be both athletic and smart. College Gs are the equivalent of that kid in little league who could swing a bat but couldn't catch anything and got stuck in RF.

Agreed on Walker#2. He sounds like Nijman in most reviews: played in a power conference, but winning with traits rather than refinement. He sounds like a guy who could be a long-term RT or swing OL after a year of PS work.

1 points
1
0
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:46 am

Hey dobber -

Wouldn't it be wicked if Rasheed Walker, Van Lanen, or Rhyan could come in an lock down the RT position? I am sure they'll give everyone a shot at RT, and I like the thought of Nijman there, but would love to see a rookie come in and lock it down for 4 years, before we have to pay him RT money.

I have a very good feeling about our depth on the OL now, which, before the draft was a bit thin. Should be a great competition in TC for sure.

(Hell, I'm even hoping (beyond reason) Caleb Jones comes in and surprises everyone to make the team and lock down the RT position. : )

It would make for a great story, if nothing else.

1 points
1
0
PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:32 am

Zack Tom played center and LT and is a top student athlete.

2 points
2
0
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:52 am

IDK how they see Tom, but it will be awesome to have some topnotch competition for Meyers at C, or a future LT in Tom... I think the scouting department did a great job identifying guys this year. It seems they all have some great reps on film against some top-level competition, so I am feeling pretty good about these OL picks.

0 points
0
0
LambeauPlain's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:07 pm

I do not think any of the 3 OL prospects will be pigeon holed to IOL. All 3 will be practicing at different spots.

The OL room for Butkus today is again as talented and versatile as it was last season. Bakht and Jenks returning to good health will make it even more talented.

0 points
0
0
porupack's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:02 am

Good thoughts on the draft, Al. I think pundits look through the lense mostly on history, and not accounting for the future team, context of how that player will be used, and the coaching specialty, and the teamates. Often said, football is a team sport, so an individual can't be evaluated without the context of cast around. How many stud players on one team turn mediocre after being swooped up by another team, likely because their first success was schemed around them and their coaches ensured the cast around them featured their trait. So I would rather trust the GM's decision than pundits decision. GM's have carefully analyzed past context, and analyzed how coaches will scheme and use that player with his selling traits.

Thanks for the draft coverage, especially from us who don't follow college football.

9 points
9
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dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:30 am

So well stated, porupack!

2 points
2
0
Handsback's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:04 am

BTW, I think Tom is the reason why they passed on JJ in 1st round.

3 points
3
0
RCPackerFan's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:43 am

Vikings -
They drafted a Safety and 2 CB's after trading back with the Lions, and Packers. I don't get what the Vikings were doing. Why did they trade back almost entire rounds with their division rival for little compensation?

Rhyan and Tom -
I think Tom can be any of the 5 spots. I could be wrong, but I feel like Rhyan will be a better OG. His size really looks like an OG. But I am willing to bet the Packers try them at both RT first, then slide inside later.

Smokescreen -
Great smokescreen, but damn didn't it cause Packer twitter world to have a heart attack when he said that.

Agree to disagree -
And that is why the draft process is so great. You get different opinions and evaluations of players. Only time will tell to who is right on them. BUT, I will fully trust what GB does. They have been very good overall in the draft process.

It matters -
At this point under Thompson I felt like I had a pretty good grasp of how he drafted. I ended up being wrong. It wasn't until they took Kenny Clark that I finally guessed his first round pick right. With Gutey, the best I can do is say this. He will draft 2-3 OL every year. He will try to pair FA signings with draft picks. Campbell/Walker, Reed/Wyatt, Watkins/Watson,Doubs,Toure. He will focus on certain positions that he feels really needs a boost. OL and WR this year. He still likes his RAS guys. As far as the vocal fans. Its best to ignore them. They are the same ones that cry that after winning the super bowl they didn't beat the team by 40.

Jigsaw puzzle -
I have also seen a lot of people comparing Walker to Campbell. Barry is a big reason why I think drafting Walker in the first round could end up being one of Gutey's best draft picks ever. We obviously will have to wait and see, BUT, I really love the fit. IF Barry can work his magic and get Walker to play at that level, our defense will be one of the best its had under Rodgers.

No thanks, we're good -
My biggest surprise was them not drafting a CB in 3 of his first 4 drafts. So now 3 of his 5 drafts. I was definitely expecting to see him draft at least 1 CB. As for Safety, I was also expecting to see them take one. But maybe its more telling that after drafting Walker in the first round and not taking a safety, that they are going to try and switch from having 3 saftey's on the field more to having more ILB's.
Since they didn't draft a CB, I would think they will be on the market for one. Possibly safety too. Do they look to bring King back?

2 points
2
0
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:29 am

Vikings: Yeah, that first-round deal with Detroit didn't make a lot of sense to me. The Vikes seemed to be so desperate to move back that they fleeced themselves by the equivalent of a third round pick. They seemed to be far more intent on number of swings. They got some of that back by dealing with the Packers.

Their situation on the back end was pretty bad. Harrison Smith doesn't run well, anymore, and is pretty much just a box enforcer. They had precious little in depth there, and they struggled with their CBs. They got a sliding Booth in round 2. If he turns out to be OK, they'll be better than expected this year. Otherwise, teams will be beating them over the top all season.

1 points
1
0
RCPackerFan's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:36 am

The trades really didn't make sense to me. If the Vikings would have gotten a first round pick next year from the Lions, it would have made more sense. But in the Lions trade they traded the 12th and 46th picks to the Lions for 32, 34 and 66. Maybe the trade chart numbers add up, but i don't think moving up 12 spots in the 2nd and getting a 3rd round pick to move down 20 spots in the first round is worth it.

I started to try and figure out all the trades the Vikings made. They made a ton of trades. To many that I stopped trying to track all of them. They started with 8 picks and finished with 10 picks. I don't know what the value was for them, but the big trades back with division opponents didn't make a lot of sense to me. Maybe in the long run they will have nailed it, but it really won't look good if Williams and Watson both end up as very good players. Especially if they torch the players they selected.

This will be a really fun thing to watch moving forward.

0 points
0
0
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:53 am

"Maybe the trade chart numbers add up, but i don't think moving up 12 spots in the 2nd and getting a 3rd round pick to move down 20 spots in the first round is worth it."

They don't. They fleeced themselves by about 40 points on the Rich Hill chart...but then, most trades looked like that this year, and they got about 20 points back from the Packers in round 2.

This was clearly the Vikings management deciding they wanted to maximize their number of swings. They could've gotten a high-end CB where they picked. They still got a pretty good--but raw--guy at 46. They had holes to fill and they're going to need to start dumping some aging guys with contracts. This is trying to be competitive behind good skill position guys as the roster turns over.

0 points
1
1
stockholder's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:43 am

Not so fast.- The Vikings got you thinking their not the enemy now. Don't get caught off guard. Ryan and Tom. So much for Nick Cross. But I like these guys better. The rotation in this Ol has never been better. We just didn't draft. We Re-Loaded.
Agree to Disagree- We all have are draft crushes. But the battle every year, is to find the guy who you can trust. Mel Kiper still has my endorsement.
Does it matter- These aren't the droids your looking for. Gutey won this draft!
The jigsaw puzzle: is why it took so long to draft a ILB and DL?
No thanks were good- Doubt it.

1 points
3
2
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:18 am

Mel Kiper doesn't draft anyone.

1 points
2
1
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 11:21 am

"Who the hell is Mel Kiper, anyway?"

Teams don't like being told "who" they have to draft.

0 points
1
1
PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:39 am

Agree Stock, the competition along the O line will certainly help. Let's not forget that Stenavich will still be putting his two cents into coaching the line.

1 points
1
0
dobber's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:54 pm

We give Stenavich all the credit, but Luke Butkus was in the room, too, and he might actually be the meat in that sandwich. We'll see how the OL evolves (or devolves) with these changes.

0 points
1
1
Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 07:57 am

I was just thinking...sure, the Pack had some rough loses in the playoffs recently, which stung for sure. But, what about the poor Bills players and fans? They made it to FOUR Super Bowls IN A ROW...and lost ALL FOUR!

Wow, that would be a tough row to hoe...so, I wouldn't mind them tasting sweet success. Unless, it was against the Pack. Then, let's keep 5 Alive!

0 points
0
0
HawkPacker's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:17 am

Kind of matches Minnie's record to a certain degree~;-))

1 points
1
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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:20 am

Hell yeah...HawkPack! Your team colors would primarily be purple too if you choked for 40+ years...:) I almost feel guilty about throwing that one down...almost.

2 points
2
0
ImaPayne's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:06 am

The Vikes have been loading up on D and got a lot of edge and corners via free agency. Obviously they have the talent and quit a bit of talent on Offence so it makes sense to bring in a horde of defensive players then pick and choose which ones you want to keep.
Zadarius has to be chomping at the bit to take Rodgers down and Rog wont have a quick pass to Adams to save him this year. Gonna be rough.

-3 points
1
4
PeteK's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:44 am

Playaction with quick toss to Jones takes care of Z.

4 points
4
0
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 11:47 am

Or run right at him...

4 points
4
0
LambeauPlain's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:30 pm

If Z even plays this year. Back injuries are sneaky bad...especially for a position that subjects it to constant pressure, unnatural bending and twisting.

4 points
4
0
stormin's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:03 pm

Go back to your Queens blog !

1 points
1
0
SnakePigskin's picture

May 04, 2022 at 10:54 pm

I think that’s what Cobb and Watkins are for, sometimes Jones and Dillon, sometimes .... ??..

0 points
0
0
Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:08 am

Hell, maybe it's the time of year or the NFL Draft & Dreams Tour piercing through my veins...but, I ain't all that impressed Jersey Al with your recent work. The past is the past (college). Oh, sureee... you got the talent to make it in the BIGs, but do you have the desire, the commitment to make a name for yourself on the biggest stage against the best of the best...do you? You will have to prove yourself, again and again.....and again. (that's me and my Lombardi speech to Jersey Al (Donald Montgomery Hutson)) :D

Go Jersey Go! (and thanks for this forum!)

0 points
0
0
HarryHodag's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:27 am

Tariq Carpenter is a safety first, linebacker second. I think they're looking for an upgrade over Henry Black.

Big and fast...the new theme of the Packers defense.

1 points
2
1
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 11:52 am

I will love just watching this kid on defense, no matter what role he plays. Think he'll be a playmaker and add another dimension we currently don't have in the secondary.

2 points
2
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:06 pm

Insanity that Tariq Carpenter lasted to the #228 Pick. Especially with his size, speed and stat line to lend immediate credence. Mind blown. 6-3 230 4.52 Ranger, ballhawk WITH run stop from Georgia Tech.

Safety? CHECK!

If you question this, seriously go do some digging on stat histories. He’s arguably better than Jalen Pitre, who only surpassed Carpenter and nearly every other Safety in the draft in TFL because he was used so much to blitz at Baylor. Carpenter was WAY better in coverage AND tackles.

I didn’t know about Carpenter. At all. I wanted Bryan Cook, and Carpenter blows his numbers out of the water too.

Remarkable drafting by Gutekunst.

0 points
2
2
Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:25 pm

Wasn't Jesus a carpenter? And to think, this kid doesn't have a prayer...come on!

2 points
2
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 01:45 pm

Yeah!!! C’mon!!! Exactly what I wasn’t thinking, but I’ll take it! Lol.

It’s funny, really, the entirety of this, these 11 players added in the draft. Gutekunst did say in his presser Keisean Nixon (FA CB), Carpenter (S), JJ (EDGE Enagbare), and Doubs were specifically on Rich Bisaccia’s list for STs.

At the same time, he did say he was looking to fill some holes on the roster in regards to some of the day 3 picks. Need didn’t trump any of his picks there he said, because it’s always best to take that best player. Said you never know where injuries might hit, etc. Didn’t specifically go looking to add 3 OTs. It just worked out that way.

Referenced Toure there, a guy they had been following for years at Montana, then through the covid year which forced a lot of transfers. He was happy to get him. Toure leading the Big Ten with 19.1 YPR??? Pure Slot??? Samori has a really good chance to make a contribution here in 2022. With Lazard, Watson & Doubs? Watkins?

Mentioned Jonathan Ford as that 0-1 NT they really liked because of the size match they look for, and that he’s proven himself at Miami to be immovable in his 50 games played with 30 starts. THAT’s the key cog I was hoping he would add after selecting Walker & Wyatt Day 1. This DL is going to be awesome.

0 points
1
1
Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 02:33 pm

Geez, okay GG...I will buy a couple dozen of those bushes. I believe you said they are a cross pollinated hybrid of poison ivy, poison sumac and hornets nest called Death Do Us Part bush...requires no rain and guaranteed to kill Creeping Charlie within 50 yards of it. Mannn, you are that good GG!

(running to the house to get my credit card from Sweet Pea...if I can pry it from her hands??!?)

Go, go, gooo...

1 points
1
0
greengold's picture

May 05, 2022 at 06:14 am

Thank you, Pantz…

I apologize to my friends here. Clearly, it’s time that I curb my enthusiasm regarding this draft, the players selected and how they might project into their new roles….

Hell, even the “new roles” have yet to be clearly defined. We haven’t gotten much info on their overall intentions with regards to - how - they want to use these players. Cards close to the vest is best might apply.

I just really like what I see, and think this may go down as Gutekunst’s best work to date.

Now,hurry, because this is a limited time offer, with a complete, 100% money back guarantee…

***
On a personal level, had some rough recovery stuff and really poured in on all this as an outlet. Maybe a little too much.

Again, my apologies, friends. “Robotics, small incisions, less invasive” doesn’t mean it won’t really F your S up! Lol. I’m progressing well tho, and really appreciate you all here. The exchange of ideas has been helpful.

Cheers! GPG

0 points
0
0
LLCHESTY's picture

May 04, 2022 at 05:53 pm

They already said they were moving him to LB.

"Tariq, we’re going to move him to the inside linebacker room. He’s a big guy, but he can run,” coach Matt LaFleur told Packers.com.

2 points
2
0
greengold's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:02 pm

Well, it’s not like they have a Hybrid Room.

All I know after watching his film, looking at his stats, reading some reviews, Carpenter can play run & pass coverage with some good proficiency. I can see him fitting in well for what they appear to be transitioning into.

I like LaFleur’s “Illusion of Complexity” ideas, and his saying he wanted same for his defense when he brought Joe Barry on. You see this in hoops all the time now, the “ positionless basketball - but, you gotta have the right players for it.

Looking forward to finally seeing that stuff in action on both sides of the ball. Who isn’t, right?

Seems like we’re finally getting some players just for those purposes, on O & D, and I’m pretty stoked to see LaFleur’s vision on O & D materializing.

* Remember those days: “Could we PLEASE get a LB who can cover?!!! Whoosh! In the rear view mirror, baby!

0 points
2
2
BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:39 pm

He's definitely listed as a Safety on Packers.com, but it really doesn't matter what they call him when he's on the field. As long as he does what they ask him to, WGA% what they call him?

He's going to beast out for sure though.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 02:35 pm

B-Dog, I do believe you are on the right scent trail...this time! :)

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BirdDogUni's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:39 pm

*Almost always... : P

Thanks -- BDU

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Razer's picture

May 04, 2022 at 08:48 am

Overall, I like this draft. I like that we didn't ignore the DLine and the linebacker position. I also like the additions at WR and OLine. Having said that - I do think that Gutekunst overdrafted at 22 and overpaid for Watson. Gutekunst falls in love (ala Jordan) with guys and buys everyone a round in the process. In both cases, he took flyers on guys who have measurables more than anything else. In both cases, these players will need to be 'developed' into their draft value. Not what you would expect with top 34 picks.

Still, I like like this draft mainly because I trust that the Packers watched enough tape and have the right coaches to make these players work. Let's hope that we have more than athletic marvels.

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croatpackfan's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:23 am

Vikings - I believe they are betting on that those 2 CBs will be available when 53rd and 59th selection would come and they decide it is the good chance. They think they went better than Packers in that trade...

Rhyan and Tom - If David Bakhtiari finally resolve his problem with knee and Rhyan beat competition for the RT position, wouldn't be hilarious to have both tackles whose main disadvantage are short arms... ;-)

Smokescreen - I agree with few posters that Draft is also smokescreen business. All of the GMs (Personnel Departments) doing the same. Using Smoke bombs to get what they want...

Agree to disagree - I'm not surprised with all those different assessments from different "scouts". There is several issues with those assessments. From many other sports it is known how evaluators very often has financial reasons to glorify or to place unfavorable assessment on different players. Also, there is the issue of doing job superficially, as there is no responsibility with written or said about any player (unlike GMs). And there might be another reasons I can think of them now...

It matters - part of smokescreen business...

Jigsaw puzzle - while I agree on large part of your claim, I also believe Walker is the young guy for the Packers future and might replace Campbell at some point (either through trading or releasing Campbell).

No thanks, we're good - Playing with 2 true LB with one good in covering they may use 3rd safety at "star" position or Jean-Charles is the option for that position as he was learning by his own words star position through year. They might see something really good at him and they are sure they can go with him. Also Packers signed Keisean Nixon (4 year player) to the roster. Also, they might waiting some releases from other teams to pick as back up.

All together nice article covering main issues we are talking about after this year Draft...

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Oppy's picture

May 04, 2022 at 09:42 am

I'm sure Bob McGinn would vehemently reject the notion, but while I'm 100% sure he has gained the trust of many "insiders" around the league for not revealing their identities, I would not be surprised if many of his anonymous sources use McGinn (and various others) to push bad information out there.

Scouts gain nothing from getting their honest assessments of players published, with the exception of possibly tipping their hand to the rest of the league. I have to believe there is always some amount of gamesmanship- and occasionally wholesale deception- when scouts comment to members of the press on their evaluation of draft talent.

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ricky's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:20 pm

Your comment on the Vikings drafting two DB's after trading with GB, it reminds me of when the Packers passed on Randy Moss in 1998. The next year, their first three picks were all CB's: Antuan Edwards, Fred Vinson and Mike McKenzie. Only McKenzie panned out, until he forced his way out of town. However, Vinson was traded to the Seahawks (and a swap of late round draft picks) for Ahman Green in 2000. Great trade for the Packers. So, if a guy doesn't work out right away, don't fret - there is more than one way for a player to help the team.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 12:43 pm

Here, here Ricky, yes! In Ahman's case, the grass was GREENer at LAMBEAU FIELD.

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Pantz_Burp's picture

May 04, 2022 at 04:27 pm

We need to have speed on the backend of the defense as well...no more human sundials!

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Oppy's picture

May 05, 2022 at 07:03 pm

Stokes (4.25, 4.29, 4.31 at pro day), Jaire (4.38), and Savage(4.36) aren't doing it for you in the speed department?

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