Cory's Corner: Scott Tolzien's story keeps getting better
Scott Tolzien has certainly come a long ways since his days as a game manager at the University of Wisconsin.
As a Badger, he was asked to place the rock into the capable arms of dominant running backs and above all else, make no mistakes. He mastered the art of the low risk passing game with a 21-5 record as a starter in Madison.
However, there was a flip side to all of his collegiate success. Many questioned what he could actually do on the next level. He attempted 30 or more passes in a game just three times in two years and many always wondered what lied beneath the percentages.
On Thursday night in Foxboro, many of those questions were answered.
The play that instantly became Tolzien’s eyebrow-raising moment was early in the second quarter. It was third and 11 at the Packers’ 39. Tolzien was in the shotgun and was flushed from the pocket. He rolled to his right and showed off his wheels by scampering for a first down.
Now the joy quickly subsided because Don Barclay was called for holding, which nullified the play. But Tolzien showed he can do more than you think.
It continued on the very next play. He threw an 18-yard laser to Richard Rodgers, leaving the Packers three yards short of the first down. Then on the next series, he lofted a perfectly-placed 26-yard touchdown pass to Jeff Janis along right sideline on fourth and 1.
Perhaps Tolzien is still miffed that he lost the No. 2 battle last year to Matt Flynn. Well, this year it’s no contest. Tolzien is showing that he’s fully capable of picking up the slack if Aaron Rodgers goes down for a brief amount of time.
The 28-year-old was basically nonexistent as a member of the 49ers and now he’s the on-deck batter in leading the most potent offense in the NFL. And just like Flynn last year, Tolzien has a year under his belt and knows the guys and the huddle that much better.
“Scott did really good things,” Mike McCarthy said. “That is a really big step. He is the coordinator orchestrating everything out there (in the no-huddle). He had the offense running at a very high tempo.”
Now obviously, people are going to jump to conclusions and think that Tolzien will follow Rodgers as the next great signal caller in Green Bay. The quarterbacks are separated by just three years. So when Rodgers decides to hang it up in say, eight years like he opined earlier, Tolzien will be on the decline.
But that’s not to say that the Packers can’t get some stability and use Tolzien like Doug Pederson was used back in the day. Smart players that put the team above themselves and always are on the lookout to expose something for the starting quarterback.
It may have just been the first preseason game, but it was a coming out party for Tolzien. He proved something to himself and his team — namely that you can be typecast as a mediocre player in this league but with enough work and patience, you can write your own ending.
Tolzien’s final chapter isn’t written yet because his plot has just gotten good.
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Cory Jennerjohn is a graduate from UW-Oshkosh and has been in sports media for over 15 years. He was a co-host on "Clubhouse Live" and has also done various radio and TV work as well. He has written for newspapers, magazines and websites. He currently is a columnist for CHTV and also does various podcasts. He recently earned his Masters degree from the University of Iowa. He can be found on Twitter: @Coryjennerjohn
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Comments (47)
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 06:49 am
Well I think Scott is already much better than some of the starting QB in NFL (let say McCown & Manziel or Buffalo Bills squad or Jets squad or ... name it by yourself!). So I think you are little bit underrating Scott in yout article... Most of the people are looking Tolzien through glasses of his first 3 games he was Packers QB. But this is like making final mark on anybody after he/she is few days on the new job. That is unfair. I believe in Mike McCarthy opinion and he said several times that his opinion of Scott is pretty high.
That is why they activate Scott last season after Aaron became injured. Thank God back up was not needed in the game but I can bet that Scott would come in the game if there was necessity...
I think if Brett Hundley will show expected development, do not be surprised if Packers trade Scott for some early round draft pick next season!
He is that good.
He is that excellent. I really do not worry about possibility Aaron will sits for few games. Packers has back up who can win the games in the meantime...
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 09:15 am
"I think if Brett Hundley will show expected development, do not be surprised if Packers trade Scott for some early round draft pick next season!
He is that good.
He is that excellent"
Respectfully Croatpackfan....You're kidding right?
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 09:24 am
Why. tell me Geno Smith (supposed to be starting QB for Jets) is better? Blake Bortles is better? Johnny Manziel is better? E. Manuel is better?I think he can battle with jay Cutler. Can you opose me to that? Or maybe you would like Andy Dalton to come and be back up QB for packers, because he is better than Scott?
Respectfully Tarynfor12.... You're kidding right?
4thand1
August 15, 2015 at 09:54 am
Teams will always pay big bucks and trade draft picks for decent back up QB's. Matt Flynn is laughing all the way to the bank. The Packers have a reputation for QB development and someone will come calling eventually. Back up QB's are back ups fro a reason, its a whole different story to be a true NFL starting QB when when the chips are down.
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 10:04 am
Yes Bortles is much better,yes I would go with Dalton over Tolzien,yes Cutler has his flaws but Tolzien isn't better and certainly wouldn't win the job from him,being better than Geno isn't saying much but the Jets will stay with Fitz and so would I.The only place Tolzien may have a shot is Cleve and that's more about McGowan being too old and Manziel being over hyped much as you're doing with Tolzien.
Will he stat in Miami,Tenn,Hous,TB,Atl,NO,SF,STL,Minn,Det,Ari,...seriously,where would Tolzien push out the starting QB where any one would give a high rd draft pick to play him now or ever.....nowhere.
sonomaca
August 15, 2015 at 10:18 am
Teams will be on the phone when the inevitable injuries occur. Question is, what will be the asking price. Second rounder?
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 10:29 am
A team having to give a high draft pick because of injuries is not the same as offering a high draft pick to be the starter over who is already there.That's an apple and orange scenario.I'm saying no team is offering a high draft pick for Tolzien to come an start regardless of who their starter is right now or at camps end less the major injury must get someone/anyone and even then a high pick isn't assured.
Thegreatreynoldo
August 15, 2015 at 10:27 am
I suggest that Croat's main point that Tolzien looked pretty good is valid. We should remember that it came against vanilla defenses and 2nd stringers but also that Tolzien played with our 2nd stringers. I do think it was clear that our 2nd and 3rd stringers are much better than NE's.
However, no one will give much for him in a trade. Tolzien is on a one year contract. Another team would have to be aware that Tolzien wouldn't know their offensive playbook or their players/receivers. Plus the packers would have to think very highly of Hundley or I suppose Blanchard to give up their competent back up QB mid-season or before the season. It would be interesting to see first how Tolzien actually plays in a real game (hope we don't find out), and it will be interesting to see what happens next year with him.
sonomaca
August 15, 2015 at 11:11 am
If they think Blanchard is as good as Tolzien, then why not deal Tolzien before the season starts? Isn't that the Ron Wolf method of developing and trading QB's?
Thegreatreynoldo
August 15, 2015 at 11:51 am
Because very few people think Blanchard or Hundley are even close to being as competent as Tolzien. Of course, the only person's opinion that counts is TT's. I also have to agree with Taryn - I would trade Tolzien for Bortles straight up.
4thand1
August 15, 2015 at 11:18 am
Barring injury, Tolzien won't get any meaningful snaps in a real game situation. It'll be mop up with a big lead most likely, handing off to whatever back up running back is playing. Hopefully a lot of mop up again this year. Also there's no way the Packers deal Tolzien for 2 raw rookies to step in at back up. Much to the dismay of some self proclaimed (experts) on here who think he's the second coming of Rodgers, in their professional opinion.
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 11:15 am
OK! Lets talk about first season for Scott with Packers and first season for Blake Bortles with jags. Scot has 55 of 90, 61.1% of passes, 8.0 yards per attempt, 1 TD and 5 INT. Total 239 ypg. Blake Bortles had in 2014 (his 1st season) - 280 of 475 58.9%, 6.1 ypa, 11 TD and 17 INT. Total 207.7 ypg. We may say Scott had better team than Bortless, but Scott was 1 week of preparation before his 1st game for Packers, while Bortles went through complete preparation (OTAs, TC, preseason games) with Jags. I think that numbers tells the story!
sonomaca
August 15, 2015 at 11:17 am
Bortles had no offensive line and no top end receivers. Fair comparison? I think not.
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 11:30 am
I do not understand why so many Packers fans can not forgive Scott those 2 and half games played completelly unprepared... But for the sake of the argument I will repeat: Blake Bortles knows what to expect. He passed through complete training camp plus OTAs etc., played in preseason games and still had worser statistic than Scott. Scott situation was similar to the pilot of the small agriculture plane who suddenly get to manage Space Shuttle... Blake Bortless at least had opportunity to show him how to do that...
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 11:26 am
Let's do this....If the Packers had a choice between Bortles and Tolzien to be Rodgers back up and it being based on neither having any previous experience with the team,who would the Packers choose based solely on talent...floor to ceiling?
IMO,Tolzien has a bus ticket out of Green Bay in a heart beat to who cares where.
I will amend one thought,perhaps he can give it a try in Hou against Hoyer,Mallet and be one of the every third week rotation starters there.
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 11:33 am
As I recollect well, Seneka Wallace was picked up to be Aarons back up, not Scott. Scott was brought to the ackers to develop him because of his upside. But lot of people has short memory... And you may claim lot of about bus tickets, but Mike McCarty always talked and talks positive about Scott. Even when he was playing the worst. I chose to believe Mike McCarthy over you...
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 12:04 pm
"Scott was brought to the Packers to develop him because of his upside."
His upside ends at filling in a game or two if need be and if any team were to bargain for him,that would be unexpected gravy on top of what was hoped...a never needing to use full time starter.
Has Tolzien grown..sure,but Tolzien will never take the reins of a true contending team under the guise of being the franchise QB or the starter they hope to have period.He cannot carry the team on his ability,he needs a very strong unit to survive and even that will not assure or keep stable the chances of that team to obtain the goal expected of them....the Packers with Rodgers are a SB contender.Put Tolzien as the starter day one,they drop to bottom of 1st tier or top of second tier as likely winners.Put Tolzien on a team much lesser than the Packers.....bottom rung in odds with no chance of climbing.That will never get a high draft pick unless utter tragedy befalls a team and has 'no choice'.
croatpackfan
August 15, 2015 at 01:33 pm
Well I see that you are true QB guru. As I remember, and it is not hard to check in archieves, TT told that he hired Seneka Wallace to be Aaron's back up and Scott Tolzien for development purposes. Mike McCarthy said that he is excited with the possibility to work on Scott Tolzien because he think that Scott has a lot to upgrade and he is very hardworking person, from whom he expects to be at the starters level in few years. Mike McCarthy never talks about Scott in negative. Even these days Mike McCarthy was saying to the reporters that he think they asked way to much when he was Packers QB in 2013... But you think that you know better than Mike McCarthy. That is OK. You have to respect yourself and your opinion, sorry, knowledge...
croatpackfan
August 19, 2015 at 07:02 am
http://www.scout.com/nfl/packers/story/1575937-tolzien-only-focused-on-t...
Obviously, I'm not the only one who thinks Scott Tolzien can play QB for several NFL teams. Please read the article, if you wish... This is another confirmation of what I was writing here...
AZPack
August 19, 2015 at 07:46 am
Bloggers can say what they want. I haven't read from a real journalist that covers the Packers as a beat writer say Tolzien has starter tools. Even tho he might start for several teams, that doesn't make him starter quality. The bottom 1/2 of NFL starters are in regular jeopardy of being replaced because the teams they start for realize w/ them at QB, they aren't going anywhere.
Personally, I don't see starter in Tolzien. Quality backup, but if he happens to end up being a starter on a team, that team is still looking for the QB they want to build around and needs to replace Tolzien.
Its very rare that McCarthy ever says anything negative about any player.
croatpackfan
August 20, 2015 at 08:41 am
Regarding Mike McCarthy and negative - see under Graham Harrell, B.J. Coleman & Vince Young. Furthermore, I did not hear (or read) from Mike McCarthy that he said of any of those QBs they can be starters!
NickPerry
August 15, 2015 at 07:33 pm
Isn't Tolzien signed for just this year?
Bearmeat
August 15, 2015 at 10:57 pm
Yes. And it's too bad for GB it's only this year. He'd be awesome trade bait. I'd bet a team like the Bills would give up a 2nd rounder for him. He's better right now than the QB situations in Buffalo, NY#2, Houston, Cleveland. Maybe more. QBs can demand high price tags.
Oh well - we'll have to let him walk in FA to an AFC team. Sign a big contract, do well, and give GB a 3rd round compensatory selection in 2017. Hundley can back up ARod for 4 years. :)
Thegreatreynoldo
August 16, 2015 at 01:07 am
Well said, Bearmeat. That is the best case scenario. I suppose TT might re-sign Tolzien in the right circumstances - say Tolzien doesn't play much at all in the regular season so other teams don't get a good look at him or he regresses.
NickPerry
August 16, 2015 at 06:24 am
Thank you Reynaldo and Bearmeat, that was the point of my question. They have him signed through this season.
A Trade? Again, based on basically 5 preseason games and 3 regular season games in 2013, it's just not enough to get any sort of high pick. I'd be surprised if they were offered even a 4th rounder, and if they were Ted wouldn't take it. Thompson isn't stupid and he sure as hell wouldn't leave himself so unprepared at back-up QB like he did in 2013 again.
The best the Packers might hope for is some sort of Comp pick next year if Tolzien bolts for a chance to be a starter. The guy throws a beautiful deep ball but what was up with those screen passes Thursday night? : )
ray nichkee
August 15, 2015 at 08:38 am
I would not rule out him starting games in a different uniform.
Cwoodson21
August 15, 2015 at 08:56 am
I just hope that it is not for the Bears.
ray nichkee
August 15, 2015 at 02:51 pm
Just for him, i hope he gets a job. The pack will still beat him. An afc team would be best so we can root for him. Im all for cuntler getting a contract extension with da bears.
NickPerry
August 16, 2015 at 06:30 am
Cutler already got one, a 7 year $126.7 million dollar mess he signed in 2014. The Bears are stuck with him this year and next season for sure. The Dead Cap hit this year is $29,500,000 million, next year $13,000,000 million. Thank you Phil Emery!!
Bill Amundsen
August 15, 2015 at 08:58 am
Always kept under wraps at University of Wisconsin so wonderful to see maturation.
4thand1
August 15, 2015 at 09:07 am
MM at his best. Remember the running game? Fixed. Back up QB, seems to be a strength. Safety fixed, and CB looks extremely promising. Now its time for ST's to shine.
DrealynWilliams
August 15, 2015 at 11:07 am
That's more of TT's doing than MM's.
I do love having both working for the Pack, so all-in-all it really doesn't matter.
I also believe this year will be MM's best year.
aj
August 15, 2015 at 12:55 pm
I don't think you can say one is more responsible than the other. Is it the players we are getting are simply that talented or is the coaching staff just that good at developing talent? I feel like it is a solid mix of both, and I believe that MM is underrated sometimes. Every time he promises improvement at a position, he delivers. He's a great coach, and I'm glad he's in GB running the Packers.
DrealynWilliams
August 15, 2015 at 04:20 pm
"... I believe that MM is underrated sometimes."
VERY MUCH SO. Now THAT is what we can agree on. The "Nobody's underdog!", the way he handled himself and represented the Pack after that BS "Fail Mary" call won me over. That's my coach **T.O's voice**
Thegreatreynoldo
August 16, 2015 at 02:28 am
Well, yes, it is hard to decide whether to credit TT's discerning eye for talent or the coaches for success stories. I do note that the Safety position was fixed with a 1st round pick. The CB position (assuming it is fixed) was fixed with a 1st and 2nd round picks (and maybe with an UDFA). One should note that Whitt has churned out CBs whether they are waiver wire pick ups (Tramon), UDFAs (Shields - maybe Gunter), mid- rd. draft picks (House, Hyde) or 2nd Rders like Hayward. The running game was fixed with a 2nd round pick, which nowadays for a RB, is a pretty high pick. One can say that TT gave MM the horses, and MM and his staff has done well with them (or you could say the coaches didn't screw it up, depending on one's point of view). OTOH, fixing the running game also means the OL, and really the OL consists of (3) 4th rd picks, a 5th, and one 1st rounder. One could say that the OL coaching (Campen) has been great, or one could say that TT found some real gems.
Campen Asst. 2005/6, OL coach 2007 to present: Couldn't do much with Colledge (2nd rd), Spitz (3rd), Moll (5th), Barbre (4th) Giacomini and Meredith (5th), tried hard with Newhouse, Sherrod, Datko, gave up on Schlauderaff, but did wonders with Sitton, Lang, Linsley, Bakh, groomed or didn't screw up Bulaga depending on one's point of view, and jury is out on Tretter. Mixed coaching record, some misses, but 4 home runs.
Darren Perry: 2/9/09 Safety Coach: He has gotten Burnett (71st pick- TT traded up for him) and Clinton Dix to play reasonably well, but not great. He inherited Collins, who had already had a pro bowl season in 2008. No credit for Collins. Perry failed with Jennings and McMillan (4th Rd). Banjo seems to play commensurate with his talent. Bigby got hurt, Peprah (5th rounder picked up on waivers from NYG) was serviceable but not good. Aaron Rouse (3rd), the 6'4" 223 Lbs safety who ran a 4.59 forty, was released after the 2nd game in 2009 and replaced by the unforgettable Matt Giordano, who I had forgotten. I don't think much of Sean Richardson myself, and view him as the Size/Speed physical specimen that Rouse was, with the same results. I note that TT hasn't drafted many safeties for Perry to coach up. Decidedly mixed coaching record.
NickPerry
August 16, 2015 at 06:49 am
Nice breakdown Reynaldo, I think it's a combination of both. The draft is having an eye for talent and a little luck and I believe Thompson has said as much himself. Just look at 2011 and 12's drafts and compare them to 2013 and 14. The Packers haven't drafted in the top 10 since 2009 so the "Blue Chippers" at least according to the experts are normally gone.
Like you've mentioned as have I, the Packers draft picks in the middle rounds are what has made this team so good. Micah Hyde is one of my all time favorite picks. A player who runs a slower 40 and drops even though he was the Big 10's CB of the year his last season in Iowa. Hyde is the perfect example WHY I think 40 times in Spandex is a joke and the attention people pay to a guy that ran 4.44 and 4.57. Just blink your eye and that's about it.
The Packers have a excellent coaching staff IMO and I think it will be even better after adding Mike Solari, the OL coach under Harbaugh in SF, and Montgomery from Oklahoma, especially Solari.
Grandfathered
August 15, 2015 at 11:39 am
Plenty of teams have need for a complete quarterback that Tolzein will be need to be paid to stay in 2016. The team might try to feature Blanchard in a game to try to make a trade - or try to sneak him onto the practice squad.
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 12:15 pm
The slightest of decent forward steps by Hundley will have Tolzien hoping for a situation like Seattle when they signed Flynn,who the Packers allowed to go FA.I do not see any team next year being that desperate to do same as like Seattle and Flynn.The only way Tolzien starts is if he is traded during preseason or during year because of injury.otherwise,Tolzien will and may even find it hard to keep the clipboard job anywhere.I don't believe the Packers have any notion of signing Tolzien back regardless of how much politically correct smoke is spouted about him.What ever he can do in mop up duty will be his buying points for others and we had best hope that is the limits we see him on the field. :)
NickPerry
August 15, 2015 at 08:51 pm
They drafted Hundley for a reason. He's a extremely athletic QB who given some time with MM could turn out to be an excellent QB. He's big, strong, fast, and has a good arm. If I was Tolzien I wouldn't be counting on the back-up job next year.
ray nichkee
August 16, 2015 at 12:34 am
Nick, you usually have sound judgment with your opinions and i respect you as a true packer fan without having to agree on everything. Between all that gibberish i read that tolzien will not hold a clipboard for any other team. The opinion is only emphasized by the string of threads. Hes a backup QB and until things change that is what he will be. I wish him the best and i see positive things in the future. Go pack.
NickPerry
August 16, 2015 at 06:56 am
Point taken Ray and I respect your opinion as well. I just don't like all the name calling and insults, it gets really old. Granted that one was a little strong Ray, he'll be somewhere if not in Green Bay. As a Wisconsin native I'll always cheer for my boys from Madison.
croatpackfan
August 16, 2015 at 02:57 am
They drafted Hundley because he should be future. Not Scott. Scott is not Aaron, but what QB are? I was never talking that Scott is at the level of the Aaron. If Brett show what is expected, I can see him taking # 2 from Scott. And I believe Scott will be starting QB somewhere else, because he is at the level of the many QBs who actually starting for some teams in NFL. How I know that? Mike McCarthy said that. He promised he will do that with Scott. And Mike McCarthy always fulfill his promises. You and me, we can make arguments here and there, but can you offer some contra-argument to MM opoinion, or to his claim that "Second-team offense had better tempo than first team". He must be delusional. It was not because of the Scott, but because there was no NE players on the field, I suppose...
Since'61
August 15, 2015 at 03:31 pm
I have finally had a chance to see a good part of Thursday evening's game and all of Tolzien's snaps. Overall, I think that he played very well considering he was playing with the Packer's second team offense against NEs second team defense and maybe some 3rd stringers. I liked his pass to R. Rodgers in a tight spot and his TD pass to Janis. It was good that he had a chance to showcase his running ability on the play he ran for a 1st down which was called back by a hold on Barclay. The one thing that I did not like about that play was that Tolzien stayed in bounds and took an unnecessary hit when he could have run out of bounds. Yes, he made the first down (prior to the penalty) but he needs to realize that if he gets hurt making a meaningless first down in a meaningless preseason game there is almost nothing behind him. Where would that leave us if A. Rodgers is injured for part of a game. I realize that if Rodgers goes down for any length of time our season is over anyway, but Tolzien needs to be aware of the situation. I'm sure that the coaches will cover that he can't backup Rodgers if he's hurt. Regular season game, on a scoring drive, I have no problem with his decision, but this is the meaningless preseason. As for Tolzien being a legit NFL starter, I think that is still a definite maybe. We won't know until we see him play and start in a regular season NFL game(s). I hope that we never see it because that would mean that Aaron Rodgers is hurt. Unless the backup QB is named Unitas, Montana, Starr or Favre I would prefer not to see Rodgers backup. Thanks, Since '61
TarynsEyes
August 15, 2015 at 03:34 pm
@Since61'...
"As for Tolzien being a legit NFL starter, I think that is still a definite maybe. We won't know until we see him play and start in a regular season NFL game. I hope that we never see it because that would mean that Aaron Rodgers is hurt."
Excellent.....My point with Croat was in a way,if the use or possible need to use your backup makes one leery,scared,afraid of the total outcome,how can he be proclaimed a starter elsewhere unless the team in question has nothing but back up talent level already which would likely make him a starter by proxy only....the best of the worst on said team.
Whether you agree in whole,part or not at all.....no ill intent with using some of your thoughts. :)
Other than Houston with Hoyer,Mallett being the competition,I don't see a team where he,Tolzien,would supplant any starter already entrenched....Even Washington with the fall of Griffin and Cousins,he may unseat McCoy as 3rd string.
Since'61
August 15, 2015 at 03:38 pm
Taryn - I agree. I have nothing against Tolzien and I wish him well in his career. Speaking for myself, I can't become overly excited, positively or negatively, about a player's performance during the preseason. Thanks, Since '61
NickPerry
August 15, 2015 at 08:43 pm
Thanks Since '61, as usual right on the money!
Since'61
August 15, 2015 at 09:49 pm
Appreciate your comment, thanks Nick. Your comments on Tolzien are accurate as well. Thanks, Since '61